Interview:Iwata Asks: Skyward Sword (Volume Eight: Those Who Played The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword for Hundreds of Hours): Difference between revisions

{{Interview|2011-11-25

|interviewee = [[Eiji Aonuma]]<br>[[Hidemaro Fujibayashi]]

|description =  

|source = [http://iwataasks.nintendo.com/interviews/#/wii/zelda-skyward-sword/8/0]

{{Interview/A|Aonuma|Yes. [[The Legend of Zelda (Game)|The Legend of Zelda]] was originally a single-player game, but I've always thought that The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword may be more fun played together with others.}}

●The design of this game is simple. I can't say it enough. This Legend of Zelda game is simple. Simple in every way.Aonuma This is another deep comment. (laughs) Iwata As this person says, the basic structure is simple. The role of each element is clearly defined. And the thoroughness of each one is…dense. (laughs) Aonuma Yes. (laughs) Precisely because of the simple structure, we could put in so much. Iwata It's simple and deep. Aonuma That's right. I think that simplicity makes you feel you can play it over and over. Leaving the hub of the adventures, Skyloft, to go down to the surface feels so easy it's like taking a little jaunt out into your neighborhood. (laughs) IwataThat idea is like the course selection screen in Super Mario.10 You can just hop on down and have an adventure.

10. Course selection screen in Super Mario: A screen on which players move a player-character across a world map to select a course to play. The system for travel in the sky game field in The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword is based on that concept.

Aonuma The fact that we changed the save system for this time around must have something to do with it too. Until now in The Legend of Zelda, you could always save anywhere, but when you started again, you were back at Link's house or at the entrance to a dungeon, rather than where you saved. The point was that starting in a place you had already been through would help you grow accustomed to the world and feel as if you were proceeding smoothly. Iwata That was the "Zelda method" up until now. Aonuma But now, if you lost to a dungeon boss, for example, and had to start all over at the beginning, you'd mostly just find that stressful. If you thought of a way to beat that boss, you wouldn't be able to try it out right away. Iwata I see. So you devised a way to shorten that time cycle so you could try out what you had thought of right away. Aonuma That's right. This time, we set save points at specific locations. It's structured so you can try out all sorts of things from that point. That also led to simplicity. Iwata This time, the trial-and-error mechanism, including the way to save, is done really well. In a simple step, you can try out your ideas right away, so you don't feel stress in various scenes of the game. In the same period of time, you can do one thing after the next. That's why you can have such dense play experience in the same playing minute.

●The first version of this game that I played was the Japanese version, but I didn't understand the Japanese at all. But when I played The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword, I wasn't aware of that and played without any trouble. People use languages like English and Japanese to communicate, but in the world of The Legend of Zelda, that wasn't necessary. Aonuma That comment is from someone in France. He said that even though he didn't understand the words, he could tell what he should do next just from the character's demeanor and other events taking place in the screen. Iwata Aonuma-san, this is incredible. This is the comment that I would never hit upon for myself without being told from a third party's perspective. I mean, we've always thought that The Legend of Zelda was a game that you couldn't do without a certain amount of verbal explanation. Aonuma Yes. As developers, we want to explain little by little what lies ahead and have the players move ahead as they figure it out. We thought it was impossible to convey that without words, but this time, it appears it got across without that. Iwata It seems so. Aonuma But I suppose it got across and you can then enjoy its unfolding depths precisely because it's so fundamentally simple. This reminded me of how important simplicity is in The Legend of Zelda. Iwata It's a tricky area for developers. There's fear over whether that simplicity will satisfy the players, isn't there? Aonuma Indeed, a lot is demanded of the Legend of Zelda series. I always worried that the players won't be satisfied if it isn't complicated. Iwata Especially as the series builds up, it tends to get overwrought. Aonuma The developers think that a more sophisticated game will provide surprises and awaken the player's inquisitiveness. But that isn't necessarily true. At first glance, it appears contradictory, but I really learned that this time—like in The North Wind and the Sun. (laughs) Iwata Yes. (laughs) That's a good example.

●People today enjoy short-term success and rewards. The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword provides that. Aonuma This is from someone at NOA.11 I think what we mentioned earlier about making it easier to start over is a big part of that. I think that matches the needs of people today.

Iwata And, you constantly experience moments of how fun it is to swing the sword, so you never get bored. Aonuma It's true that you hardly ever feel like you're being forced to do something. Especially overseas, they tend to demand a lot of freedom and don't care much for RPGs with a single path forward. In the case of The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword, there may only be one path system-wise, but you never get the impression that there is no freedom. Iwata Because each battle is full of freedom? Aonuma Yes, I think so. Tons of stuff shows up that you want to try. I think that's important.

●I've never been very good at video games, so I've never cleared one before. But this game tells you where to go next, with the Sheikah Stone videos to offer assistance, so I think more people will be able to play to the end.

●It's a dream come true! Link can run! Enemies guard! (Unthinkable in The Legend of Zelda so far.) And traveling through the sky! There's a high degree of freedom and it satisfies the desire everyone has to fly.

●Something different about the game is that some adults are hopeless.Iwata I introduced them together, but these are all comments responding to the question of what is the same and what is different compared to previous Legend of Zelda games. Aonuma That last person continued with something funny, so I'll introduce that, too.

●Among the NPCs [non-player characters], there's Pipit's Mother who spends all the money her son saves doing night patrol, Owlan who tells his student who is running around to save Zelda that he is looking for a new species of plant as a hobby, and Jakamar who shows no sign of looking for his daughter who has disappeared.Iwata Right, they're are pretty hopeless. They have a lot of character! (laughs) But I can sense the love behind this comment. Aonuma In general, a lot of comments said the characters are incredibly charming. Iwata I think the characters in the series have been plenty charming so far, so why do you think people say that is especially true this time? Aonuma As mentioned in the previous comment, I think the biggest reason is that aside from the regular characters that appear, you sense that the enemies have personality as well. A big part of that is the effect of their battle reactions, and how Fi provides these brief explanations, like how the Bokoblins are obsessed with underpants. (laughs) They are actually the elements needed for the gameplay, but everyone gets a sense like "I bet this guy is like this." Iwata I see. Something else that surprised me is how everyone has their own feelings and how the points and details they mention are so different. Aonuma Yes, that's right. Everyone's comments are so different. Iwata Everyone thinks fighting is fun, but when it comes to which characters they like or what things are good, they cheerfully mention all sorts of things. That is a really good thing. I'm happy about it.

●I remember playing The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening12 on my Game Boy as a child, but I hadn't played any games in the series since. When I heard that I would work on The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword, I wasn't sure what to think. But playing this game was so awesome that I instantly became a fan.

12. The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening: The first game in The Legend of Zelda series for the Game Boy system released in August 1993. In December 1998, the remake The Legend of Zelda: Link's Awakening DX was released for the Game Boy Color system.

Iwata This comment is from the translator who was in charge of German. Aonuma A lot of people say that they were playing the series for practically the first time. I'm so happy that people like that can play for hundreds of hours and say, "I want to play more!"

●One appeal of The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword is a return to the origins of the series. It departs from the mold set by The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess13 for a welcome change and is worthy of the crown of The Legend of Zelda.

13. The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess: An action-adventure game released for the Wii console and Nintendo GameCube system in December 2006.

Aonuma The extreme simplicity is linked to a return to the origins of the series, giving birth to a newness that is similar but different. Iwata As we return to the issue that arose earlier about why you could pull off such a revolution, I would like the game's director, Fujibayashi-san, who has been present as an observer, to participate. Fujibayashi All right, thank you. Iwata So, Aonuma-san, what is behind the revolution this game represents? Aonuma That's not easily summarized, but everything that has accumulated until now and the influence of Fujibayashi-san's personality as director are both important. Iwata Where did the game begin accumulating things from? Aonuma To be specific, I think The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time became the standard for me for home console Legend of Zelda games. The series built up from there and nothing ever got made from scratch. I think subconsciously there was a strongly conservative voice saying, "This has to be this way," and "If you change it too much, people won't like it." Iwata A series with a tradition behind it can't avoid that kind of complication. Aonuma I've always felt that, and after we made Twilight Princess, I assumed an objective position as producer of The Legend of Zelda: Phantom Hourglass14 for the Nintendo DS system and made all sorts of unreasonable requests with regard to that to Fujibayashi-san, who was the subdirector. (laughs)

14. The Legend of Zelda: Phantom Hourglass: A stylus controlled action-adventure game released in October 2007 as the first title in the Legend of Zelda series for the Nintendo DS™ system.

Iwata So…Fujibayashi-san? Fujibayashi Yes, I did get a lot of unreasonable requests. (laughs) And that led to Skyward Sword. Iwata I think your circumstances this time were like those of Miyamoto-san during Super Mario 64.15 At the time, Miyamoto-san chose, from among all the various ways of making Super Mario games, what to leave in, what to throw out and what new to add. Everyone still talks about the shock of that, and the game has demonstrated certain methods for all the 3D games that followed. The Legend of Zelda franchise also has done the same thing with Ocarina of Time.

15. Super Mario 64™: The first 3D action game in the Super Mario™ series. Released for the Nintendo 64 system in June 1996. The remake Super Mario 64 DS was released for the Nintendo DS system in December 2004.

Fujibayashi Yes, that's right. Iwata You've been making 2D Legend of Zelda games for a long time. On the basis of that experience, you attempted your first 3D Legend of Zelda this time for a home console. With the know-how that has built up over the years and expert staff members—and Aonuma-san and Miyamoto-san as well—it was the best environment for developing a 3D game, and I think you must have experienced the same thing that Miyamoto-san did back then. Fujibayashi Yes. I really was blessed. Aonuma I'm quite jealous. I can't experience that anymore. Iwata Your struggle night and day continues but now faced with an even higher hurdle. (laughs) Aonuma I really don't know what to do! (laughs) For the next one, if we will build on the methods we established this time, we might end up getting into a rut. Fujibayashi That's difficult. I'm thinking about the next game, too, and I feel like the hurdle is really high. Aonuma But there is a lot left that we didn't do this time. Iwata You have limited time and people, so there's bound to be something left over. But five years is a long time. (laughs) Can't you do it in three years next time? Aonuma Sorry! You're right! (laughs wryly) Fujibayashi Sorry, I'll think of something that can happen in three years! Iwata You must be surprised to hear all these great comments today, are you blushing? Fujibayashi Well, I'm speechless! (laughs) Listening today, I felt as if I may have achieved a little of what I tried to learn from Miyamoto-san. It's a little hard to say, but… Iwata What is it? Go ahead. Fujibayashi When I've made games, I've always thought, "Why is it that Miyamoto-san's games sell for 10 or 20 years?" What I thought was that Miyamoto-san's games are about intuition rather than culture. To make an extreme example, the exciting points would be the same for cavemen as it is for us who're in the present. You don't need linguistic or cultural knowledge. Aonuma That's right. Fujibayashi Earlier, we heard from someone overseas who said that the game could be enjoyed even without understanding Japanese, and I thought, "Oh, have we been able to make it so that people can play with intuition?" It was entirely uncalculated to me, but I feel like Miyamoto-san's genes, cultivated throughout the 25 years of the history of The Legend of Zelda unexpectedly generated a landmark with this title that took back from the origins of the series. Iwata When Miyamoto-san made Ocarina of Time, it involved packing contents into a much smaller box than we have today, and he must have wondered how to do it, so tons of knowledge and innovation were necessary. This time, you were able to pour lots of energy into how you could be considerate toward the player. Fujibayashi That's right. Iwata Meanwhile, the two of you established an incredibly simple structure and packed in depth, volume and variation. Doing it that way opened a new frontier. Fujibayashi Yes. Aonuma I think so, too. Iwata Aonuma-san, what did you think today? Aonuma I keenly felt how lucky I am. I'm lucky to have kept working on The Legend of Zelda all these years, and I think I was able to hit upon an answer together with Fujibayashi-san and Miyamoto-san for a challenge we had been thinking about for a long time. And this isn't the end. Rather, I feel like we can keep moving forward. It isn't good to rely on luck or chance, but that's how I feel. Fujibayashi Aonuma-san, that's important. Nothing happens by chance. Iwata No matter how much you plan, there is no guarantee. You plunge ahead toward what you can't see, and results are born of a mix of what turns out as planned and what doesn't and the unexpected. Aonuma Making games all this time, I've experienced that to a certain degree, but I can say that the synergy this time was greater than I had ever experienced before. Iwata Frankly, I think what you mean to say is "We made something awesome!" (laughs) Aonuma-san, you are a lucky person. Aonuma Without a doubt. This is its 25th anniversary, so The Legend of Zelda must be lucky, too! (laughs) Iwata Thanks to the powers above. Aonuma Yes. "Skyward" is a good word to describe Nintendo!16 (laughs)

Iwata Aonuma-san, Fujibayashi-san, and everyone who provided us with comments this time, thank you. "Iwata Asks" about The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword is complete for now. Thank you very much.