Is Anyone else Worried About Difficulty?

[DarkestLink]

I know Zelda has always been an easy series since OoT came out, but is anyone else getting particularly worried about Zelda Wii U? With non-linearity, there are a number of things I worry about such as puzzle, direction, story, and creativity...but what worries me most is the difficulty. It is true that LoZ-LA were less linear and harder games...but Nintendo was different back then. Back then, Nintendo wasn't afraid to challenge their players. Now? God forbid a casual find themselves unable to beat their dungeon on the first try.

What worries me is that if this game is non-linear, that means the typical casual player can stumble into Dungeon 7 first. And Nintendo, being Nintendo, will not want them to get stuck...so this brings us our problem: Is anyone else worried that, to keep the casual player from failing, Nintendo will make "Dungeon 7" as easy as "Dungeon 1"? Currently, Nintendo can increase difficulty per dungeon as players get more experienced and gain more power ups. But with their catering to casuals, I don't think they can make the later dungeons as hard as they normally would when they run the risk of a 10 year old newb with 3 hearts finding himself in an overly difficult later dungeon and crying to his Mother when he can't beat it.

 

[Vaati101]

I'm sure they will give hints as to what to and not make it overly difficult like the original Zelda. I don't think their trying to make it like the first Zelda Game, but they are trying to make it less linear. I think what they are trying to work out is a balance between the two so that it's satisfying for both Casual and Core gamers. As long as there is some linearity in Zelda, I won't be worried about the difficulty, but I do want to see difficulty progression.

 

[Tetra's Wink]

From my experience I honestly thought LA was really easy

 

[Sir Quaffler]

I was going to say no, but then I started thinking on it more...

You bring up a really good point about how non-linearity could serve to make the game too easy. That's what I've found in my recent playthrough of the original LoZ. People talk about how the non-linearity made the game so much better, and to a certain extent I can see where they're coming from. Not being forced to go to the dungeons in any particular order does in fact allow you to take on the later dungeons earlier, and it's a pretty good freedom as compared to being tied down to one dungeon at a time. But the problem I ran into was, all the dungeons were pretty much the same except for that last one. I know that's because of the limitations of the NES, but I don't think that issue will go away even with modern technology. Since they had to account for the fact that certain players such as myself can find themselves in level 7 before level 1, they had to modify it so that I could get through the dungeon. And by that I mean they dumbed it down. (So I guess I'm in the minority when I say that I find the first LoZ really easy.)

That's why I'm a proponent of linearity in games. Not the run-down-corridor-until-you-get-to-the-floating-arrow-then-run-down-more-corridors type of linearity, but the type seen in the modern Zelda games. You can more effectively plan around certain situations because you have a pretty good idea of the level and player skills at the time, and because you can plan around what the typical path will be. Egoraptor backs me up on this:
[video=youtube;Aip2aIt0ROM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aip2aIt0ROM[/video] 00:46 mark and 08:50 mark. (NSFW language, btw)
Now I'll admit that SS at times felt TOO linear (like did we really have to be restricted to getting the three flames in the exact order we did? Why could we not have chosen to try and take on the other two regions before Faron Lake, even if we weren't able to get that far?) but on the whole I agree with the story structure. They had a specific idea of the story they wanted to get across, and they conveyed it effectively. Making the game all non-linear would break the story of the Zelda games.

I understand that Nintendo is trying to rectify certain mistakes SS made, but some of these recent remarks by EAD is indeed starting to get me worried. It's like, rather than build off of what the past few games have gotten right and improving what needed to be fixed, they're going in a completely different direction altogether. I mean shoving multiplayer into Zelda? Sorry, but I'm not buying that. Zelda's a single-player experience, but half the fun of it is talking to fellow fans about the games and playing the games with other people around for fun. But forcing multiple people to take part just doesn't sit right with me.

...Oh dear Lord I'm sounding exactly like some of the hardcore TP fans now...

 

[DarkestLink]

It isn't just that I found LoZ dungeons to be the same...it's also the fact that Nintendo has changed over the years. I just don't see Nintendo allowing players to be as challenged as they were in the old days. Back then beating a game was serious business...but these days, Nintendo WANTS you to beat the game. In the end, I fear non-linearity won't be the same as it used to be...

 

[ihateghirahim]

Skyward Sword represented a distinct increase in difficulty for me, but now I see it is part of a continuing decline. Never in any game since OoT have I started cussing aloud in fury. That water temple pushed me over the edge. I want to know that pain again.

 

[Ventus]

I'm definitely NOT worried about difficulty. Nintendo will not give a casual fan a non-linear game because nonlinearity means stumbling across Dungeon 8. The linear games (everything since after MM; MM is linear but isn't easy) have always been easy, the nonlinear games have had many stones in the pathways meaning things were tough.

I am fully confident Nintendo will return to the old days and give us that tough game, that's doable if you take the RECOMMENDED path but hard as nails when going on your own. <3

 

[Spirit]

I'm not going to be bothered about it until i actually see it. We don't know how theyre going to go about the non-linearity, there are so many ways that they could do it. Coupled with 'challenging the convention of playing by yourself' it is impossible to say right now. We could end up with a 4 Swords wiiU on our hands or something like Monster Hunter as far as the relationships between other players and NPCs etc.

We have to see what the game is first before i get a problem about probably difficulty woes even though I'm worried to hell that i'll have to play with A.Is to get things done...

 

[A Link In Time]

Nonlinearity does not equal easier dungeons. While the dungeons in the NES games could be completed out of order, the ascending levels were each harder than the last. In Ocarina of Time, where the five Adult Link dungeons are of almost equal difficulty, Nintendo chose a fair medium that was no pushover and less challenging than its predecessors bar LA but not obvious. While recent dungeons are far from the most difficult in the series, Ninty still manages to make 100%ing the adventure a challenge.

I'm not too worried about difficulty. Nintendo has actually been prodding gamers a bit farther with newer releases like Super Mario Galaxy 2 and New Super Mario Bros. U. Nintendo vowed to make its casual Wii players into true gamers with the Wii U. we're currently experiencing the transition phase.

 

[Justac00lguy]

Hmmm Difficulty....

This always an odd topic when it comes to Zelda and everyone seems to think that a lot of Zelda games are very easy :/ To me I don't think Zelda games are all that easy I think it just depends on the gamer! When I 2as new to the Zelda franchise....Boy did I struggle! I think it took me a while to complete the 1st Dungeon and I mean a while! As I have played more Zelda games I have come to know the basic controls and gameplay mechanics as well as puzzle solving.

I wouldn't say Zelda games are tough by any means, its just that I think each Zelda game offers enough challenge to make it reasonable. Sure though they could definitely up the difficulty and this could be achieved with much harder Dungeons, tougher bosses, smarter AI, Non-linearity Ect. I also think by having a larger Zelda game in terms of content, collectibles, SQ's could definitely relate to a more challenging experience.

 

[Curmudgeon]

I haven't been pushed by a Zelda game since MM. It's no longer a series I look to for a real challenge, though sometimes the easiness can be annoying (if not borderline patronizing). TMC was a delightful experience, except that I have no idea what the game over screen looks like... I never felt close to threatened. Same with WW and TP. I think the quarter heart damage norm has made combat a lot less dangerous and was pleased to see that the enemies hit harder in SS. That's not to say they weren't fun games to play... I'd just like a little more pushback sometimes.

I wouldn't mind seeing a difficulty slider that increased enemy damage and decreased item drops... sort of a scalable Hero Mode

 

[The Wanderer]

Am I worried about difficulty? Not particularly. It's a cause for concern, but I believe it's a small one.

First, as A Link in Time said, the Wii U is theoretically designed to reign back in hardcore gamers. If Nintendo's going to follow that statement up in Zelda, they're going to make Zelda Wii U a bit harder and less casual than we're used to. If they're "rethinking the conventions in Zelda" and going back-to-basics, upping the difficulty once again falls in line. They seem to be dropping little hints that they've been listening to the fans and will respond accordingly.

How Nintendo could, should, and probably will handle the difficulty in dungeons is by making players do one basic dungeon from the start, something to help introduce the concepts of combat and puzzle-solving. After that, the world is free for roaming, and players know better what to do and how to handle the opposition. As A Link in Time also said, Ocarina of Time's dungeons were somewhat non-linear and still carried a uniform but challenging difficulty to them. I'd imagine Nintendo would at least do something similar in Zelda Wii U.

What they might do instead is give you little "packs" of dungeons to do at a time. "Here are three dungeons - complete them in any order you want. Got them down? Good. Here are three more dungeons. Complete them in any order you want." They may wind up doing this, which is still an interesting move to make, even if I would prefer full non-linearity.

My own suggestions are to add difficulty levels and scale up enemies as players progress. I imagine Nintendo will still have some sort of "Super Guide" feature, which is fine; I never used the Sheikah Stones in Skyward Sword, but I appreciated their presence. Puzzles can always be pretty difficult to new players without turning them away so much, and Sheikah Stones can help alleviate the pain for those who are stuck. It's the enemies we should watch out for, really, and both difficulty levels and enemies that get stronger as you progress through the game can take care of that problem.

I predict Nintendo will take actions to make Zelda Wii U more challenging, although they'll still allow side doors for the casual audience. This may not be the hardest Zelda game ever, but it'll probably pick up the pace a bit.