Spoiler Did Demise Ruin Ganondorf for Anyone Else?

[MW7]

Personally I felt like it was kind of pointless to invent a "new" character called Demise. I don't really get to involved in the story of Zelda games so basically for me they could have just called him Ganon just the same. There both the epitome of evil within the Zelda universe, and anyway Demise looks very similar to the Dark Beast form of Ganon in Twilight Princess standing on its hind legs. To someone that doesn't pay attention to cutscenes, I wouldn't be surprised if someone looked at Demise and thought "Wow they sure made Ganon ugly in this game."

 

[TheBlueReptile]

I personally wouldn't *under*estimate anyone if I were a major villain.

You've just taken on an entire civilisation, forced the humans into the sky and driven a goddess into mortal form. Then a kid in a floppy green hat and baggy pants stands in front of you.
Of course you are going to under-estimate him.

 

[Ventus]

You've just taken on an entire civilisation, forced the humans into the sky and driven a goddess into mortal form. Then a kid in a floppy green hat and baggy pants stands in front of you.
Of course you are going to under-estimate him.

I certainly would, that is if I *just* did it.

Demise was trapped for eons, he said himself that he could spare a few moments to wait on Link. He was cocky and for no good reason. He claimed that the humans he knew were of cowardice and it was spectacular that Link was borne out of them. He stupidly mistook the humans of Link's generation for the kind of his time. Demise, in all, was stupid. I, on the other hand, am not stupid. If you were stuck in comatose, suddenly woke up and found something totally different than what you were used to, you would be ALERT, no matter how you used to be all those years (centuries, eons, etc.) ago. Demise was the opposite.

 

[TheBlueReptile]

I certainly would, that is if I *just* did it.

Demise was trapped for eons, he said himself that he could spare a few moments to wait on Link. He was cocky and for no good reason. He claimed that the humans he knew were of cowardice and it was spectacular that Link was borne out of them. He stupidly mistook the humans of Link's generation for the kind of his time. Demise, in all, was stupid. I, on the other hand, am not stupid. If you were stuck in comatose, suddenly woke up and found something totally different than what you were used to, you would be ALERT, no matter how you used to be all those years (centuries, eons, etc.) ago. Demise was the opposite.

Just imagine a rat squaring up to you. That's how Link must have looked to Demise. And, regardless of when a rat is born, it is still a rat.
I still think you're giving yourself too much credit and/or plucking at strings to find more ways to nitpick.

 

[Ventus]

Well, I am, but that's just because I'm not a snob like Demise was.

'cept Link wasn't a rat. Did Demise not note the glowy sword? No, he didn't. All he paid attention to was "hahaha, i was badass back in the day so...nothing can take me now"/

 

[JuicieJ]

I certainly would, that is if I *just* did it.

Demise was trapped for eons, he said himself that he could spare a few moments to wait on Link. He was cocky and for no good reason. He claimed that the humans he knew were of cowardice and it was spectacular that Link was borne out of them. He stupidly mistook the humans of Link's generation for the kind of his time. Demise, in all, was stupid. I, on the other hand, am not stupid. If you were stuck in comatose, suddenly woke up and found something totally different than what you were used to, you would be ALERT, no matter how you used to be all those years (centuries, eons, etc.) ago. Demise was the opposite.

I don't think that argument holds up. I mean, every single human ran away from him previously. It was only Hylia that stood up to him. Seriously, how could you think one boy out of millions could have the ability to overpower you if that was the case? I don't care how long it was. That doesn't change the fact that no human had ever faced him before. It's not like being sealed away for 1000 years allowed him to realize that maybe some human could defeat him. This isn't the same sort of principle as regretting something you've done while sitting in jail. (I know you didn't say anything like that.) If I were as powerful as Demise and just had the spirit of Hylia absorbed into me, I'd be pretty cocky, too. You're looking at this through the eyes of, "I know how powerful Link is because I've seen him fight countless powerful foes before." Demise doesn't have that logic, therefore has no idea how powerful Link is. You can't apply our logic to Demise's situation.

 

[TheBlueReptile]

Well, I am, but that's just because I'm not a snob like Demise was.

'cept Link wasn't a rat. Did Demise not note the glowy sword? No, he didn't. All he paid attention to was "hahaha, i was badass back in the day so...nothing can take me now"/

He may well have noted the 'glowy sword'. But, like you said, he'd been sealed away for eons. He had no idea that Master Sword was anything but a regular sword.
Even if he did, that's still just a rat with a toothpick

 

[JuicieJ]

Sure enough it is, but with Skyward heralding "change", I'd expect to see better villains. Ones that, y'know, actually HARM people rather than temporarily hold power then fall to what appears to be a chump.

Every villain winds up falling like a chump in Zelda in the end. Ganon, Majora, Onox, Veran, Twinrova, Vaati, Zant, Malladus, Ghirahim, and Demise. They all fall to a mere boy at the end. Sure, that boy is the chosen hero, but he's still a boy. That's pretty embarrassing to an entity who almost conquered the world.

The problem there is that Link *technically* was on the same level as TP Ganondorf and Demise. Demise didn't have a piece of the Triforce and neither did Link. Demise didn't have Hylia completely sucked into his essence, I wouldn't even say partly, so Link wielding the True Master Sword would put him, and clearly did, on the same level of Demise. Ganondorf just came into power at that one point. Demise JUST got resurrected. They're cocky and we've seen it a billion times. Ridiculous that they would underestimate a little boy, regardless of their station. I personally wouldn't *under*estimate anyone if I were a major villain.

Ridiculous? He's a teenager. Teenagers in general society are underestimated. What makes you think a powerful villain would think differently?

Go play Red Dead Redemption if you haven't already. Near the end of the game something totally unexpected happens to the main protagonist.

That doesn't mean a thing. That was just one game, not a whole series where a hero always appears to stop an evil force. You can't accurately compare RDR to Zelda like that. It just doesn't work.

They are evil, yes, but what they do makes them look incredibly weak. Nintendo can make better villains, ones that have a real impact outside of that "last epic battle" that we've seen time and time again. People need to die, people need to be harmed, entire races of things need to be destroyed IN GAME. Otherwise, I'll be displeased and continue to nitpick.

Whoa, man, chill out. The reason that doesn't happen is because that's not what Zelda's about. If that sort of thing were to happen, it'd be pretty stinkin' dark for a family-friendly game. Zelda isn't The Elder Scrolls. That kind of stuff will never happen in the Zelda series simply because that's not what Zelda is. There's really nothing more to it than that.

 

[Indiglogo]

I enjoyed Demise.

I do agree that the final Ghirahim battle was tougher.

Demise makes sense for the series and Ganondorf's origins. He screams Ganondorf when you see him anyway. His hair, the way he speaks, his facial features and even his pre-battle theme when he's talking to you. It sounds a bit like Ganondorf's theme.

The battle with Demise was a bit, tacked on I'd say. (but i found it hilarious how he says he's waited for ages and he doesn't mind you taking your time. Did NOT expect that one xD) It'd be cool if he had a castle or something. There are also a few time paradoxes with his resurrection in the past and traveling back to the future... But oh well, it's just a game right?

 

[Moonlight]

@VanitasXII: What? do you think Vaati is any better? He sucked! I think a true fan of the Zelda series would not put down a classic character because he is bored of it. You know, how do you like a new generation of kids who are bored of Link? hmmm. lets get a new main character. To my eyes it's the same thing, as if someone were putting down Link. Ganon was great in Tp and a lot smarter then Demise. He has an interesting volcabulary unlike demise! He was in the first game! I grew up with Ganondorf he is my favorite villain in entertainment history. He did a lot of stuff in OoT actually we just never got to see the scenes. (play OoT again.) A lot of your posts seem as if you started playing Zelda when Tp came out. They introduced Ganon near the fourth dungeon of the game thats in the middle. They introduced Demise at the end of the game and his stances his role everything is to me was more of a Ganon rip off. If you want to play a game with different bad guys each game go play a shooting game! Other then that expect seeing Ganon again!

 

[Spirit]

I didn't like Demise too much either, I would have much preferred Girahim to be the final boss and he could have summoned a something, like Demise to fight against him with Link, Outnumber Link in the final battle or have Demise as a really hard to defend against special move during the fight. I was gutted when Girahim fell and turned into the sword since i think Link and Girahim really had a good rivalry going.

When Nintendo said they would show Ganondorf's origins I figured it'd be a cutscene after the game, like a stinger after the credits of a movie, and that cutscene could have shown Ganondorf rising from whatever Girahim had started prequel stories usually do that... kick you in the teeth after you've sorted everything out. I also didn't feel the need for Demise to spell out the curse of the three chosen ones Link, Zelda and Ganondorf cycling with each generation, after playing TP and WW and other Zelda games I thought it was common knowledge, being an origins story I knew it would say it at some point but it didn't need to make a meal of it with Demise's last words...

Though the main thing that bugged me most about Demise, other than only showing up at the end with a backstory that sounded a little like Ganondorf's from OoT after the seven year jump... was the fact that he looked like Akuma from street fighter...

 

[Yuuki]

Perhaps Demise being of such great power (far greater power then a Goddess who even made attempts to break through the seal laid upon him in the ground) was able to cast a spell to somehow effect the destinies of the future Zelda/Link's as some one stated before;

Demise's hate never perishes, so Ganondorf just keeps coming back over and over without end. My thoughts on his origins are still the same. I view him as an evil Gerudo male who wants the Triforce (in a nutshell). It's not like Demise's hate caused Ganondorf to be born. It's just why he's so evil (and why he always comes back).

So perhaps this 'curse' Demise used just fuels Ganondorf's ambition to capture the Triforce not necessarily 'created' Ganondorf. Girahim even states to Link before he revives Demise:

I realise a simple child like you knows nothing of magic.

Perhaps there are far greater forces then just the Triforce.

 

[Emperoreddy]

Here is a thought I just had (and decided to register to share ). One thing different about Hyrule in Skyward Sword from almost any other Zelda is its source of evil. It is clearly stated all the evil comes from demons, which Demise is king over. The mortal races are all good, in fact they are 100% completely and totally good. You don't once hear or see a Hylian, Goron, Mogma, etc really doing anything evil at all (the robots are rather rude, but not evil of course lol). The mortal races are never described as overally greedy, ambitious, or evil, not even in the back story. Compare that to the chronologically later Zeldas games and you get plenty of that. You get the whole Gerudo race, backstories of civil wars, whole armies of men in LttP fighting over the location of the Golden Land. None of this strife in Skyward Sword's time though. In fact I always got a naive, young vibe from the peoples in the game, everything felt very primordial in this time. Even the ending itself, with the Triforce just kind of chilling out in the open like that.

Anyway the point is what if Demise's curse was like Pandora's box in a way. The curse was to infect evil into the moral world, into mortal hearts and minds, which eventually manifests itself into the ultimate personification of MORTAL evil, Ganondorf. Maybe it was this curse that corrupted the mortal world, led to the need rehide the Triforce away from Mortal hands (the only beings we have now learned who can actually use it, a fact Demise must not of known).

In this way Demise is and isn't Ganondorf, he isn't directly Ganondorf in anyway, but Ganondorf is the most direct personification of evil in the later ages and is a mortal instead of a demon/god/big ugly fire guy.

Just a thought.

 

[Crash]

Here is a thought I just had (and decided to register to share ). One thing different about Hyrule in Skyward Sword from almost any other Zelda is its source of evil. It is clearly stated all the evil comes from demons, which Demise is king over. The mortal races are all good, in fact they are 100% completely and totally good. You don't once hear or see a Hylian, Goron, Mogma, etc really doing anything evil at all (the robots are rather rude, but not evil of course lol). The mortal races are never described as overally greedy, ambitious, or evil, not even in the back story. Compare that to the chronologically later Zeldas games and you get plenty of that. You get the whole Gerudo race, backstories of civil wars, whole armies of men in LttP fighting over the location of the Golden Land. None of this strife in Skyward Sword's time though. In fact I always got a naive, young vibe from the peoples in the game, everything felt very primordial in this time. Even the ending itself, with the Triforce just kind of chilling out in the open like that.

Anyway the point is what if Demise's curse was like Pandora's box in a way. The curse was to infect evil into the moral world, into mortal hearts and minds, which eventually manifests itself into the ultimate personification of MORTAL evil, Ganondorf. Maybe it was this curse that corrupted the mortal world, led to the need rehide the Triforce away from Mortal hands (the only beings we have now learned who can actually use it, a fact Demise must not of known).

In this way Demise is and isn't Ganondorf, he isn't directly Ganondorf in anyway, but Ganondorf is the most direct personification of evil in the later ages and is a mortal instead of a demon/god/big ugly fire guy.

Just a thought.

That makes a fair bit of sense actually. And Demise did know he could use the Triforce. It was stated that the gods couldn't use the Triforce, but there's nothing to stop a powerful demon from using it, considering he isn't a god.

 

[Emperoreddy]

That makes a fair bit of sense actually. And Demise did know he could use the Triforce. It was stated that the gods couldn't use the Triforce, but there's nothing to stop a powerful demon from using it, considering he isn't a god.

I thought Zelda said somewhere he couldn't use it either. Overall it makes much more sense that I am mistaken, but I could of sworn I read that during that scene. Zelda's point and opinion on the nature of the Triforce as existing as hope for mortals against the gods, and things on their level of power (such as demons) sort of plays into this though. It doesn't seem to cross anyone's mind that humans would abuse it, only the demons would.