Breath of the Wild BOTW's combat problems

[Ventus]

Look the game is cool and all but it has some legitimate issues.

1) lack of enemy diversity leads to samey battles after the first six hrs of playtime
2) no enemy has a "Defense" stat which makes the weapon damage literally a function of subtracting however many hits you can get outta weapon with rating XX from the HP pool ZZZZ.
3) lack of weapon diversity which leads to samey battles after the literal first 2 hours of playtime.
4) elemental attributes are merely functions you use to play with the environment and serve no purpose in terms of damage the enemy. sure you can freeze a foe to bide time, you can shock a foe to grab their equipment, and you can light the surrounding area aflame but honestly, why take the time to do any of that when you can run around with the Hitstun Sword and **** some hoes up?
5) enemy AI is ******** to say the least
6) flurry rush is too easy to abuse

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[Jamie]

Why do they need a defense stat if they have an HP stat? Think about that for a second. Let's say they have a .5x damage defense modifier and 50 HP. That's no different than having no modifier and 100 HP. Why does it matter?

 

[Libk]

Some enemies do actually have element weaknesses, like the wizrobes. I hit the fire one with an ice arrow, instant kill. Fire arrow, not much.

On top of that, some enemies are weaker to certain items. Example being Stone Talus. The iron sledgehammer kills him in like, 5 hits. Only 12 damage. Dragonbone club has a 45 ratimg, takes longer to kill stone Talus. So there is probably a lot of complexities to the combat that just hasn't been figured out yet.

 

[Cartoonmaniac]

At least its an improvement in diversity for Zelda standards. Before, you only had one weapon (and some items) fighting enemies without HP or Defense stats. BOTW isn't trying to be Final Fantasy, it's Zelda.

 

[Lozjam]

Look the game is cool and all but it has some legitimate issues.

1) lack of enemy diversity leads to samey battles after the first six hrs of playtime

I absolutely disagree with this. The dynamic AI and the environments surrounding enemies drastically change the surroundings, and there is plenty variety of enemies once you get out of the plateau.

2) no enemy has a "Defense" stat which makes the weapon damage literally a function of subtracting however many hits you can get outta weapon with rating XX from the HP pool ZZZZ.

Uhhhhh... Why is this a bad thing? The last thing I want to worry about while playing Zelda games is doing more math.

3) lack of weapon diversity which leads to samey battles after the literal first 2 hours of playtime.

I think you are forgetting about the Runes however, of which has a ton of diversity and environmental cues. Plus, the use of different weapons keeps that variety going. Especially with having different types of hits.

4) elemental attributes are merely functions you use to play with the environment and serve no purpose in terms of damage the enemy. sure you can freeze a foe to bide time, you can shock a foe to grab their equipment, and you can light the surrounding area aflame but honestly, why take the time to do any of that when you can run around with the Hitstun Sword and **** some hoes up?

You literally just contradicted yourself here. So yeah. As to answer your question however. I don't even know what a Hitstun Sword even is...... So that's why I would take the time to "do any of that".

5) enemy AI is ******** to say the least

The Enemy AI is absurdly smart actually. Yes, the bokoblins are dull witted. And that's the point. However, once you get to enemies such as Lynel's, Lizals, and Moblins, they actually prove to be insanely smart, aggressive, and versatile.

6) flurry rush is too easy to abuse

I quite agree with this.


The problems with the combat are not ones that you have listed(of which I think are extremely weak points when pointing out the flaws of this system). I think there is a lot of merit to the fact that this game often times challenges the player to not partake in combat, and find another solution. This could be sneaking past enemies, using Runes, blowing stuff up. However, I think there is often instances where they perhaps give the player too many bomb barrels to blow up. This makes some situations a little bit too simple, and too easy. Moreover, I think that performing some of links attacks are very clunky. Doing a jump attack is actually pretty uncomfortable sometimes, because you need to press Y immediately after X, while still keeping track of the enemy. And using stamina attacks are very useful, however, I do not like that there is no way to cancel the attack while charging.

 

[Fraxinus]

Eh, I try to save better [stronger and/or more durable] weapons for battles with stronger enemies so I don't waste them on keese or something stupid like that. Which gives me issues because REEEE your inventory is full. I've hardly familiarized myself with combat, but I can tell there are issues. I'm not sure I like the fact that the attack power is really only associated with the weapon (for both Link and the enemies), so you fight a bunch of the same enemies as you travel but they just maul you with more powerful clubs instead of being a more powerful variety of monster or something. Or the fact that enemies' weapons don't break on them. Not fair. Moreover, no base attack stat or anything.. would make sense for base attack to increase after completing x amount of shrines or w/e. I actually had a very specific complaint about combat the other night but I forget what it was. It was something along those lines, I think.

To combat control issues... my main issue (a nice blend of my incompetence and the game's button mapping) is the jump button. Generally in Zelda combat, I'm huge on dodging with side-hops and back flips and I'm finding it near impossible to adapt to the jump button, so my technique is in pieces. The buttons are more of an issue for me than just that, though. The Wii U gamepad has always confused me, especially with its shoulder buttons and while realistically it makes sense that the [ZL and ZR] buttons are in front of the R and L buttons, my instinct is switching them in my mind so every time I go to use my bow, Link gets ready to throw a weapon and vice versa. I could turn this into a tangent about my complaints about the controls and the fact that first person and third person camera axes settings being universal, but I'll stop myself.

 

[Jamie]

I absolutely disagree with this. The dynamic AI and the environments surrounding enemies drastically change the surroundings, and there is plenty variety of enemies once you get out of the plateau.

Uhhhhh... Why is this a bad thing? The last thing I want to worry about while playing Zelda games is doing more math.

I think you are forgetting about the Runes however, of which has a ton of diversity and environmental cues. Plus, the use of different weapons keeps that variety going. Especially with having different types of hits.

You literally just contradicted yourself here. So yeah. As to answer your question however. I don't even know what a Hitstun Sword even is...... So that's why I would take the time to "do any of that".

The Enemy AI is absurdly smart actually. Yes, the bokoblins are dull witted. And that's the point. However, once you get to enemies such as Lynel's, Lizals, and Moblins, they actually prove to be insanely smart, aggressive, and versatile.

I quite agree with this.


The problems with the combat are not ones that you have listed(of which I think are extremely weak points when pointing out the flaws of this system). I think there is a lot of merit to the fact that this game often times challenges the player to not partake in combat, and find another solution. This could be sneaking past enemies, using Runes, blowing stuff up. However, I think there is often instances where they perhaps give the player too many bomb barrels to blow up. This makes some situations a little bit too simple, and too easy. Moreover, I think that performing some of links attacks are very clunky. Doing a jump attack is actually pretty uncomfortable sometimes, because you need to press Y immediately after X, while still keeping track of the enemy. And using stamina attacks are very useful, however, I do not like that there is no way to cancel the attack while charging.

The AI is not insanely smart. You must be joking.

 

[Lozjam]

The AI is not insanely smart. You must be joking.

There have been multiple times, where particularly Lynel's have intentionally cut me off, and isolated me from my horse(then killing my horse) to prevent me from escaping.

Sheikah Guardians will automatically search for Runes that you use, and take the option to disrupt it right there. Not only that, but whilst I was fighting one, it consistently changed up its fighting style when I started abusing a single tactic.

Lizals use their camouflage to nearby surrounding areas, but whenever a bit of smoke comes into the mix from fire, they hide within that. Not only that, but Lizals will intentionally drag you into the water near the ocean and try to drown you.

These are just a few of really clever things that I found that A.I. Doing.

 

[Jamie]

There have been multiple times, where particularly Lynel's have intentionally cut me off, and isolated me from my horse(then killing my horse) to prevent me from escaping.

Sheikah Guardians will automatically search for Runes that you use, and take the option to disrupt it right there. Not only that, but whilst I was fighting one, it consistently changed up its fighting style when I started abusing a single tactic.

Lizals use their camouflage to nearby surrounding areas, but whenever a bit of smoke comes into the mix from fire, they hide within that. Not only that, but Lizals will intentionally drag you into the water near the ocean and try to drown you.

These are just a few of really clever things that I found that A.I. Doing.

Absurdly smart is an absurd exaggeration.

 

[Spirit]

I keep my good weapons for enemies that i know are going to be a pain so i dont really have a problem keeping hold of high grade weapons until bosses or Guardians come around.

BotW may not have the hidden skills of TP or the parrying on WW but i dont think the combat is any worse than those entries. It may look simplified on the surface but when youre forced to use a heavy/slow weapon or a long range one when everything else has broken it makes you change up how you fight, you have to re-adapt to the fight which is better than what TP and WW did.

You then have elemntal stats etc. Using an element on a standard chu chu will give different drops etc which i like.

The only combat problem i think BotW has is that if you manage to have all your weapons break youre then rather powerless and have to rely on your runes which really just comes down to bombs unless there are metal crates around.

Some 1HP hand combat would have been something.

 

[MW7]

This is my fault, and I'm still pretty bad at the game. However, one thing that bothered me yesterday while playing is that I'm walking along the path to Eldin Tower, and an enemy spawns behind me while I'm running and immediately one hit kills me with an arrow when I had 9 full hearts. For the most part the game's challenge seems fair, but that seemed just annoying. Also I wish combat trials weren't a thing. I get excited to solve a puzzle whenever I find a shrine, and as soon as I found my first combat trial, I was disappointed. Once I found two combat shrines in a row, and that's one of the few times that the game wasn't fun for me at all. Overall the game has been great though.

 

[the8thark]

Look the game is cool and all but it has some legitimate issues.

1) lack of enemy diversity leads to samey battles after the first six hrs of playtime
2) no enemy has a "Defense" stat which makes the weapon damage literally a function of subtracting however many hits you can get outta weapon with rating XX from the HP pool ZZZZ.
3) lack of weapon diversity which leads to samey battles after the literal first 2 hours of playtime.
4) elemental attributes are merely functions you use to play with the environment and serve no purpose in terms of damage the enemy. sure you can freeze a foe to bide time, you can shock a foe to grab their equipment, and you can light the surrounding area aflame but honestly, why take the time to do any of that when you can run around with the XXX Sword and **** some hoes up?
5) enemy AI is ******** to say the least
6) flurry rush is too easy to abuse

My opinion on these points . . . I'm not saying his concerns are not legit, I am just sharing my opinions here.

1. A fair comment, but eventually you will find new things to combat if you travel around enough. I just found a new enemy type after about 15 hours game play. I agree what you say is happening, but most games ever created suffer the same issue and most others even worse so. Saying you get samey battles after 6 hours is a long time when other games feel like that within few hours. Legit concern of all games, not just BotW.

2. Not an issue in my opinion, it just makes the game easier to understand. I think it's a good easy way to judge the effectiveness of weapons. Not at all boring.

3. Refer to my reply in point 1. Also if you think this is an issue then you'd must really have hated previous Zelda games when most of what you do is kill things with the one master sword. I agree it's an issue, but of all video games, not just this one.

4. Why do you keep putting spoiler content everywhere? That sword, not everyone knows about and it is spoiler content.

5. It's better than most games of it's kind. Far from perfect, but far from crap either. I've often had the enemy pick up weapons of mine or throw barrels of TNT at me. Sure the AI can be exploited, but compared to the average Zelda game it's better.

6. I would guess that's intentional to balance the difficulty of the game. You should like the harder difficulty modes of the game when you get to play them. Especially that new hard mode coming in the DLC.

The only combat problem i think BotW has is that if you manage to have all your weapons break youre then rather powerless and have to rely on your runes which really just comes down to bombs unless there are metal crates around.

This is a serious issue in the game. Not a major one but it did frustrate me early on.

 

[Jamie]

I could be wrong but I don't think XXX Sword is a real sword. Pretty sure it's just an arbitrary name he used for a generic sword. That aside, if we can't even discuss sword names without putting SPOILERS in big letters that's just silly. Get off the BotW board if that's such an issue. It's not a plot spoiler.