Things That Were Just Horrible Ideas in the Zelda Series

[Kybyrian]

I can absolutely NOT stand central dungeons. The Temple of the Ocean King and Spirit Tower were just completely horrible ideas, in my humble opinion. The Tower of Spirits wasn't quite as bad as the Temple of the Ocean King because it had some rather unique designs, but I still don't like the idea of going back to the same place after every single dungeon and doing almost the exact same thing for every single floor to progress. It makes it seem boring and like there is less effort put into the game, in my opinion.

Another thing that was kind of bad in my opinion is what Durion, PJDEP, and Kitsu were remarking. The Howling Stones weren't really that good in my opinion. It just ruined the songs, really. Then the transforming into a wolf seemed annoying. You had to talk to Midna every single time that you did so. They should have just made it so that there was a button you could press and instantly transform. Also, they could put the wolf form as mandatory in some of the more interesting parts of the game. The least they could have done was make the parts that it was in a little more interesting. Collecting the Tears of Light was completely boring, and I really hated the idea. The Tears of Life themselves were just bad, and it made the wolf form bad because you used it mainly during those sessions. There was a lot that could have been improved on there.

Slow, restricted travel is another thing that really gets on my nerves, as well. In Phantom Hourglass the travel was really boring and extremely linear. You almost wanted to set it down and wait for it to get over, but you couldn't even do that. The game refused to let you survive by leaving the game by throwing in enemies that are easily shaken off in a lousy attempt to spruce up the travel a little bit. The train travel in Spirit Tracks also sucked. It was especially bad later in the game when you were trying to get all over the map and it was all very slow. The warps helped a bit, but not much, in my opinion. The train moved very slow and there wasn't much you could do as far as your paths go. They once more added in little pathetic enemies so you couldn't just sit there and chug along. They even tried to add in the collectible rabbits. This was a bad idea. The rabbits were just a hassle and very boring to collect. It really didn't add much to the train travel except for maybe the first two or three times that you encounter a rabbit. After that, you just want to get where you're going without the hassle of a slow train and stopping to catch bunnies along the way. It would have helped if they had upped the train speed. I hope we don't see any Zelda games in the future that have such restricted travel that makes it completely boring.

 

[43ForceGems]

Taking away magic. That was a terrible decision.

Not making ST have button control option, after a lot of people didn't like that about PH (including me)

 

[Dagoth Ur]

The lives system in AOL and how you go all the way back. ruins it for me.

 

[athenian200]

I definitely agree about central dungeons and the removal of the magic meter. Worst ideas ever.

I also didn't care for the howling stones. Why couldn't there have been a real instrument?

People who have made video games or do programming understand. You're only given a certain amount of memory in anything that involves a computer. You want to be as efficient as you can. If you create an over storage space for something like rupees, the game could freeze or have other complications. You also leave less memory for other features when you do this. Even in MM, you couldn't have unlimited rupees. The designers have to set a bar on what they believe is the most efficient numbers for rupee collection. Personally I thought 1000 was perfect. You could pretty much spend as much as you want without really worrying about running out. Also, it wasn't difficult to fill your wallet back up once you did run out. I mean seriously, what are you gonna spend that much money on other than the golden armor? Especially once you open Malo Mart in Castle Town. Everything is ridiculously cheap there.

No, actually, that's not entirely true. The limitations are largely arbitrary for game control purposes right now.

Allocating one byte of data allows you to store up to 255 rupees. Anything over that requires two bytes, and two bytes can store up to 65,535 rupees. So technologically, any limit higher than 255 rupees, and lower than 65,535 is arbitrary. The same amount of space will be used to store the amount, regardless.

It actually costs far more in bytes to store treasure chests than rupees in the player's hand. You need to record the location in X,Y, Z coordinates, each taking at least a byte. Then, you need a fourth variable telling you what item is inside, and fifth variable indicating whether it's open or closed. That's a minimum of 5 bytes, often going over 10. Not counting the size of graphics and programming code.

 

[AlaskaAce1996]

The difficulty of Twilight Princess, it was just way too easy and Nintendo only cares about new players and Twilight Princess reflects that.

 

[Random Person]

No, actually, that's not entirely true. The limitations are largely arbitrary for game control purposes right now.

Allocating one byte of data allows you to store up to 255 rupees. Anything over that requires two bytes, and two bytes can store up to 65,535 rupees. So technologically, any limit higher than 255 rupees, and lower than 65,535 is arbitrary. The same amount of space will be used to store the amount, regardless.

It actually costs far more in bytes to store treasure chests than rupees in the player's hand. You need to record the location in X,Y, Z coordinates, each taking at least a byte. Then, you need a fourth variable telling you what item is inside, and fifth variable indicating whether it's open or closed. That's a minimum of 5 bytes, often going over 10. Not counting the size of graphics and programming code.

Where are you getting this data from? Not that I'm doubting you, I'm curious in such things and need to expand my knowledge about them.

I've heard of the values of one bytes and two bytes in other languages, but i don't know the specifics in gaming programming. And I don't believe your making it up since you know how to use the terms properly.

 

[WeeGee]

My list is in no particular order:

1. The Chess pieces in LA that you were supposed to throw and stuff. WORST. PUZZLE. EVER. It was just so stupid, i didnt get it. Can someone explain them?

2. Not continuing the use of Magic Containers. I liked these more than just upgrades, i would like to see these in SS.

Ill add more, but i want to know what you think.

Magic containers? I don't understand? Do you mean Magic Bar a.k.a. Magic Meter?

 

[Baysiderulez]

Magic containers? I don't understand? Do you mean Magic Bar a.k.a. Magic Meter?

In Adventure of Link you could collect Magic Containers to increase the amount of magic you could hold at one time, while leveling up your magic so that it didn't use as much magic to cast a spell...

I can absolutely NOT stand central dungeons. ... but I still don't like the idea of going back to the same place after every single dungeon and doing almost the exact same thing for every single floor to progress. It makes it seem boring and like there is less effort put into the game, in my opinion.

I have to say I agree. Centralized dungeons seem to serve no real purpose except to make you turn around and do something else. I can see returning to a specific location in between certain points of your journey as an adventurer, but not a dungeon.

I for one HATED the Great Sea in WW. I felt traveling around in a boat was boring and un-interactive. There would be many times I'd play my song, cast my sail, go make a sandwich, use the bathroom, and still have time to spare before I got to my location. That's just not gaming to me, I would really like to see future Zelda games be more interactive.

 

[nicktheslayer]

More:

Useless items like the spinner and such. (They shouldve made a rollercoaster that used the spinner)

Not making a fourswords for the WII/Gamecube that is in 3d and plays like windwaker (Hopefully will happen on the 3ds though)

 

[linebyline]

Here's my vote for the number one Zelda blunder: Making certain games' timeline placements obvious. For one thing, many of us enjoy the challenge of formulating and refining our timeline theories and now Nintendo has decided to spoon-feed us. At the same time, the lack of ambiguity can bulldoze certain parts of our theories. Example: No more debate over whether the timeline starts with OoT or MC, and there's a 100-year stretch between WW and ST that we can't do anything with unless there's another Great Sea game staring WW Link and Tetra (a la Phantom Hourglass) or Hyrule has train tracks in it. Direct sequels like PH and MM are one thing (though even that's not a sure thing since I've seen people put OoX between LttP and LA) but this just bugs me.

The howling songs part on Twilight Princess, it was fairly good concept overall, until you had to listen to both Wolf Link and the Hero's Shade houl the tune together. That little cutscene is something that I have always hated in Twilight Princess. You can't skip it, and it absolutely slaughters the classic songs that sounded great on Ocarina of Time.

Agreed. It might have been cool if you were actually learning songs for your grass whistle the way that we've been learning ocarina (or whatever else) songs ever since Link's Awakening. And if the howled versions sounded remotely like music. But it seemed to me like they were just there for the sake of being there. Why make me learn a tacked-on gameplay component that isn't used anywhere else, when any old ancient stone tablet would do? Can't I just attack it a la MM's Owl statues, or (i dunno) just read it?

Lol. I have an idea. How about we take this ONE LITTLE GREEN RUPEE out of my wallet, and replace it with an orange on OF THE SAME SIZE.

People who have made video games or do programming understand. You're only given a certain amount of memory in anything that involves a computer. You want to be as efficient as you can. If you create an over storage space for something like rupees, the game could freeze or have other complications. You also leave less memory for other features when you do this. Even in MM, you couldn't have unlimited rupees. The designers have to set a bar on what they believe is the most efficient numbers for rupee collection. Personally I thought 1000 was perfect. You could pretty much spend as much as you want without really worrying about running out. Also, it wasn't difficult to fill your wallet back up once you did run out. I mean seriously, what are you gonna spend that much money on other than the golden armor? Especially once you open Malo Mart in Castle Town. Everything is ridiculously cheap there.

Hence in Metriod, Samus could have up tp 255 missiles. The game cartridge could probably have handled more, but you only have so many bytes to play with in password saves. Athenian is right about the limit being arbitrary, but the fact remains that there must be some limit.

Other technical limitations could be responsible, such as the number of place values available on the screen. That's why the upper limit in Link's Awakening (if I remember right) is 999, not 1000. (That's also why you could only get 99 of any item in the original Pokémon games, and why the duplication trick turned the numbers into weird graphical doohickeys. A higher number was stored okay, but couldn't be displayed correctly. But you probably knew that.)

With modern console games, I think that (aside from wanting to add upgradable wallets as a gameplay element), the reason for the limits is more likely so the number would be easy to remember. To someone who doesn't know or care about binary math (see below), 65,535 seems a little arbitrary.

Where are you getting this data from? Not that I'm doubting you, I'm curious in such things and need to expand my knowledge about them.

I've heard of the values of one bytes and two bytes in other languages, but i don't know the specifics in gaming programming. And I don't believe your making it up since you know how to use the terms properly.

Bit = binary digit. A 1 or a 0, though to the computer it's more like on and off.

8 bits is a byte, which means a byte is an eight-digit, binary number. The highest possible number is therefore 11111111, (which you and I know as 255 in decimal).

If you allocate two bytes, you get sixteen digits, and the highest number is 1111111111111111 (decimal translation: 65,535)

It doesn't have much to do with specific programming languages--it's basic computing. But not every program stores data in bytes (or octets if you're talking network packets): ASCII characters, for instance, are only 7 bits. Yes-or-no values are often stored as a single bit, but not always: MySQL databases use the smallest possible numeric data type, which I don't remember offhand but I can assure you it's more than one bit.

But you have to admit, there is something of a logic problem with the story when you can only hold 99 rupees whether you have 99 green ones or a handful of more valuable ones. Also: When you have 98 rupees and pick up a fiver, where to the other three go? I'm just going to say that, except in TP, rupees possess the magical ability to transform into exact change. And that isn't exactly horrible; at worst it's an occasional reminder that it is just a game, and at best it's an excuse not to have to worry about making sure you have enough green, red, blue, etc. so you can always make change.

As for the actual having to put the rupees back in TP, that was horrible. Even if you don't care about 100% completion, it's a pain in the butt to be looking for the dungeon item and keep going back to that same flipping chest that you've opened and shut a hundred times. And while I'm on the topic of horrible, rupee-related aspects of Twilight Princess, how about having to see a message every time you pick up a rupee in a color you haven't picked up since you last turned on the game? That got old fast.

 

[SavageWizzrobe]

The Zelda series has had a few changes that really bothered me:

1. Removal of the magic meter
-This limits the inventory. It's a shame; many magic-consuming in the series are fun and/or useful (magic arrows, spells, rods, ...).
2. Making bosses too predictable and too easy
-I expect a challenge when I fight a boss, but I can't break a sweat if I know that I have to use my new item three times to kill it. Nintendo needs to stop limiting themselves with this stale boss formula.
3. Anything to do with Rupees in TP
-*opens chest* "You got 100 Rupees! But your wallet's full, so you have to put it back!" *restarts* "You got a Blue Rupee (5)!" -.-

 

[Mikau94]

The bosses are too easy, make them more like Metroid bosses, I actually get killed by those!

I think nintendo has been making bosses easier so that people don't get irritated and stop playing Zelda. The larger the target audience, the better a games sells.

The howling parts just sounded horrible to me.

 

[Shadsie]

I make no secret that I love Twilight Princess...

However, the thing that I think about for this thread would be... the Guardian Puzzle to get the Master Sword. You know, where you, as a wolf, hop around and try to get the two statues to follow you. I didn't think it was stupid as a puzzle overall, it's a rather interesting puzzle, it's just that... putting it at that point in the game. I've already run around dealing with the Skull Kid and his annoying death-puppets. I've been through enough and want my Master Sword already!

 

[DeletedUser9]

Huh. I think maybe you guys are exaggerating? Or perhaps the original poster didn't intend it so strictly as it sounded...

Basically I don't think anything in the series, including every single idea mentioned in this thread thus far, is actually a horrible idea. I think plenty of them might have not worked as intended, or were poorly executed, but I think they were all interesting ideas that should potentially be reconsidered at another time (not to mention a few of the things mentioned I have no issues with and actually like, such as centralized dungeons).

Many things in Twilight Princess come to mind as things that were poorly executed. Same with Spirit Tracks (IMO Phantom Hourglass was a little boring but a very well designed game). But since I feel that none of them are horrible, I have nothing to add really.

 

[benjibibbles]

AoL as a whole. Seriously, what was that?