Rito Tribe

[Onilink89]

most of us know the Rito Tribe in WW. the main subject about this tribe that i always questioned is: did the zora race really evolve in to the rito tribe, is so how come?

now there are clues that prove this, like medli, got the zora logo on her clothes and she carries the bloodline of the zora sage. but would it not be better if they remained zora's? i mean you got the great sea and all of a sudden they have wings thanx to lord valoo.
or is lord valoo the cause that the zora 's became rito's?

[firebunnies123]

whats so great about valoo anyway? hes just a fat dragon

[MiniMeMilo]

Well if the ocean was infested with tornadoes and and monsters it wouldn't be a very safe place at all, would it? I don't know if the Ruto truly did evolve from Zoras overtime, but if they did it would be because of the danger which was now in the water.

[Chrono]

Lord Valoo gave the Ruto tribe the ability to fly, it says so in the game.

[Kybyrian]

The Ruto tribe was once the Zora tribe? I've never seen anything like that before. Interesting. So, Lord Valoo is the cause of the Zoras being there no longer, but instead, begin part of the Ruto Tribe?

[Onilink89]

firebunnies123, what you are posting is spam.

anyway the only 2 clues that i have is that medli carries the bloodline of the zora sage.
and her logo on her shirt
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/cb/Medli.jpg

there is a possibility that the Rito was once the zora, but that lord valoo is the cause, i'm not sure about that. as avenged said, he gives a scale to grow wings.

[Kybyrian]

Perhaps they were the Zoras. After all, things got bad in the Sea. Perhaps the found refuge on {name of island Valoo roosts on} and Valoo gave them wings. That's just my guess though.

[Onilink89]

hmmm yeah, but is valoo also the cause of their evolution? or did they adjust their forms like how the kokiri became koroks.

i mean kolami is a rito without wings at the start, the chief explains the system of that rito 's go to valoo to recieve the scale to grow wings on a certain age.

back to main main question. who believes that the rito were once the zora?

[Kybyrian]

I do believe that the Rito were once the Zora. Perhaps something made them evolve to the forms they are now. Like said, Valoo only gives them the wings, but the bodies like that were already there.

[MiniMeMilo]

I completely believe that the Rito tribe are ascendents of the Zora. Think about it; if the Kokiri had enough time to evolve into something as different as the Korok, don't you think the Zora could potentially become a beaked tribe of wingless man-birds? Although that leaves the question, why are they born without wings? I don't think they will ever start growing wings, since such drastic changes are unneeded as long as Valoo is in existence.

Another thing that leads to this theory is the similarity between the name of the tribe, and the name of a sage. Don't you think Rito, the tribe of man-birds from TWW, sounds oddly familiar to Ruto, the Zora princess and also a sage, from OoT?

[RyanNope]

If the Zora turned into the Rito then why are there Zora scales in PH which is a direct sequel to WW.I think that the rito are a completely different race. there is a possibility that the Zora entrusted the Saffire to the rito tribe, and thats why there is that symbol... but don't you get the saffire from that whale thing?

[Kybyrian]

The sapphire thing is Nayru's Pearl and you get it from the giant fish, Jabun. Just because there are Zora scales in PH doesn't mean the Rito weren't Zoras at one time. The scales could have just been left behind.

[Onilink89]

yes but you miss one big point here, PH is a sequel alright, but it plays in a whole other world.

[MiniMeMilo]

yes but you miss one big point here, PH is a sequel alright, but it plays in a whole other world.

Are you sure about that? I don't own PH myself, but from what I've heard it's a direct sequel and is in the same time period.

[Onilink89]

Are you sure about that? I don't own PH myself, but from what I've heard it's a direct sequel and is in the same time period.

yes its a direct sequal from WW. but PH it plays in a other dimension.

[Smitie]

yes its a direct sequal from WW. but PH it plays in a other dimension.

i don't have ph, but i think your right. in ww link and tetra go to another land at the end of the game.

[zeypherlink]

Yes...The Zoras evolved into the Rito over time. Just like the Kokiri evolved into the Korok. I learned about this in biology...its called adaptaion. They pretty much couldn't go on in their current state, so over time they develpoed different physical qualities.

And Valoo gave them the ability to fly, it says so in the game.

[MiniMeMilo]

yes its a direct sequal from WW. but PH it plays in a other dimension.
Sorry about that, I assumed that PH was in the same setting as TWW was. I don't own the game, nor do I remember the ending in TWW. Now that I understand that, it even further strengthens my beliefs that the Rito are the evolved creatures that came from the Zora.

I just remembered something crucial to this theory. As you all know, Makar is a Korok from Forest Haven who plays the violin. Fado is a Kokiri, and also the previous Sage of Wind, who played the same violin as Makar does. Is there a possible connection here?

Medli is a Rito from Dragon Roost Island who plays the harp. Laruto is a Zora, the former Sage of Earth, and plays the same harp that Medli is seen playing too. Not to mention she is wearing the same sash type cloth that Medli is wearing. Is this yet another connection between races?

[firebunnies123]

so if zoras turned to ritos that makes sense. I still believe it would make more sense to stay zoras since most of hyrule is ocean. Sure there are monsters in the sea, but down below by hyrule castle (where king of red lions takes link) it is pretty safe. Also on the subject of ph what world are link and tetra in? I have the game and its pretty stupid they say its a different world. It has a lot of the same races like gorons.

[Alder Dragon]

so if zoras turned to ritos that makes sense. I still believe it would make more sense to stay zoras since most of hyrule is ocean. Sure there are monsters in the sea, but down below by hyrule castle (where king of red lions takes link) it is pretty safe. Also on the subject of ph what world are link and tetra in? I have the game and its pretty stupid they say its a different world. It has a lot of the same races like gorons.



When you finish the game you'll find out, I don't want to spoil anything for you. PM me if you have any questions.

[Onilink89]

Sorry about that, I assumed that PH was in the same setting as TWW was. I don't own the game, nor do I remember the ending in TWW. Now that I understand that, it even further strengthens my beliefs that the Rito are the evolved creatures that came from the Zora.

I just remembered something crucial to this theory. As you all know, Makar is a Korok from Forest Haven who plays the violin. Fado is a Kokiri, and also the previous Sage of Wind, who played the same violin as Makar does. Is there a possible connection here?

Medli is a Rito from Dragon Roost Island who plays the harp. Laruto is a Zora, the former Sage of Earth, and plays the same harp that Medli is seen playing too. Not to mention she is wearing the same sash type cloth that Medli is wearing. Is this yet another connection between races?

uuuhm yes, thats what i tried to explain in my first post. and thats the one huge clue why the rito may have been the zora 's. and it is explained in the game that the koroks were once the kokiri. so if this is related on bloodline, then the possibility of the rito tribe were once the zora"" is big.

Edit: i'm currently busy replaying WW, and i'm at the part were Laruto the zora sage is now talking.
this is what she said:
"You must find the one who carries on my bloodline...The one who holds this sacred instrument..."

[Mases]

What doesn't make sense to me, like many others have said in this topic, why did the Zora need to evolve if the land was flooded. They are already excellent swimmers and this type of world best suits their physical features.

However, once they gained the ability to fly, Darwinism would say that because the swimming capabilities of the Rito were now obsolete, their survival was based solely on flying skill. While they didn't inherit wings as genetics and rather, were given them, they would never grow their own wings, but their 'fins' for swimming would probably disappear over the long haul. I suppose their beaks also formed because of survival of the fittest. Maybe the beak helps their flying capabilities, so those with poor or no beak slowly died off while the dominant beak Zora/Rita survived.

I suppose I'm probably over analyzing the Darwinism aspect of evolution. Either way, I wasn't quite happy with the Rito tribe evolution, if it even really is an evolution and not a completely different tribe. I'd much rather have them be different species all togethor. As a Zelda fan, the bigger the better, the more the marrier. Thus, rather than 'eliminating' one race to create another, they should have just introduced a whole new race (which they possibly even did so). I'd love to believe that and in future games see the Zora and Rito both in the same game, much as I'd like to see several of the other so called 'evolved' races blend in as well. A game with 10-12 different races would be sweet.

[Chrono]

What other so called races..the Koroks? Its proven they were evolved from the Kokiri. Also, maybe they couldnt survive int he ocean since they are..fresh water creatures? When have the Zora lived in the ocean?

[zeypherlink]

What other so called races..the Koroks? Its proven they were evolved from the Kokiri. Also, maybe they couldnt survive int he ocean since they are..fresh water creatures? When have the Zora lived in the ocean?
Haha, very true. We only see them in Lake Hylia and in the Rivers.

[Onilink89]

What other so called races..the Koroks? Its proven they were evolved from the Kokiri. Also, maybe they couldnt survive int he ocean since they are..fresh water creatures? When have the Zora lived in the ocean?

uuuhhhm... thats what i also was thinking, but then i missed also one very important point.
majora's mask, the zora there live in the sea.

and yes it is proven that kokiri are the koroks. the great deku tree tells you that the once had a human form but they were forced to djust their form due the great flood.

[Chrono]

Well i think Termina is the exception. We got the Gerudo who are now pirates, Zora who dwell in the sea, Gorons who live atop an ice mountain... MM was just a huge acid trip IMO.

[Smitie]

the rito also have a protector deity like the zora's in Oot had. the rito have valoo and the zora's had lord jabu jabu

[Onilink89]

the rito also have a protector deity like the zora's in Oot had. the rito have valoo and the zora's had lord jabu jabu

got a point there.
by the way, i discoverd something today. apperently midna is not the only one who wears the zora logo. prince kolami also has the logo when he has wings. the logo is on its necklace.
it may not be a huge clue but still this means that midna is not the only one who wears it.

why you ask? because laruto the earth sage could also meant something else with the "bloodline", the sage bloodline. medli could also be the resurrected form of a sage. Like that owl (forgot that name) in oot. he also was sage in a ressurected form. if medli was the only one wearing the zora logo, then there was also a chance that she 's just a resurected sage.

now that i have seen the logo on prince kolami, i'm starting to believe more that the rito are the zora. there may be more clues in the game that i havn 't noticed yet.

[Mehplep]

I liked that part with a ressurected sage, but it have a hatch... Laruto asked Link to find her decendant, not her ressurected form. Medli is a decendant to Laruto, and not Laruto herself...

[Mike Pothier]

Yes, I do believe the Rito are descended from the Zora tribe in OoT. But I think 'evolved' is the wrong term here. IIRC, the Deku Tree specifically said that the Koroks once took the form of children, which to me implied they were changed unnaturally, probably using magic. Its possible the same happened with the Rito tribe.

[Smitie]

Yes, I do believe the Rito are descended from the Zora tribe in OoT. But I think 'evolved' is the wrong term here. IIRC, the Deku Tree specifically said that the Koroks once took the form of children, which to me implied they were changed unnaturally, probably using magic. Its possible the same happened with the Rito tribe.

That could be possible. maybe the gods changed the zora into the rito because if they could swim, they would see the old hyrule under the sea while the gods wanted hyrule to be forgotten.

[Onilink89]

That could be possible. maybe the gods changed the zora into the rito because if they could swim, they would see the old hyrule under the sea while the gods wanted hyrule to be forgotten.

i still think the the zora evolved in to the rito

it may sound unlogical that why the zora evolved when there is a huge ocean.
and i don 't think that they just evovled from the dangers of the sea or they can 't stand salt water.

there is one important fact that i missed.
the king of red lions said that before hyrule became flooded, people took refuge in to the mountains.

he also said that you have to find the temples from above because you can 't acces it from hyrule anymore. so its sounds more logical that the zora evolved in to the rito.

[Leix]

Here's my offset opinion:
The Zora didn't evolve. Why would they evolve? If their water mass just got BIGGER why try and live above water?
No, I considered the Korok's evolution. The Koroks learned how to fly using the leaves provided by the Great Deku Tree Jr.
The Gorons are either IN the mountains, or mostly wiped out, but they still exist so It's not Gorons.
Hylians obviously are still around on islands.
The Gerudos...are still pirates i'm sure. I believe that they lived in the fortress and then Ganondorf turned them all into pigs.
So what major race does this leave?
What race is the only one with beaks, and still canon?
What's the race that everyone forgets, figuratively and literally?
Skull kids.
Skull kids have beaks. And if they're all lost in the forest, how can they figure out how to do things like Koroks? Through the spirit of Valoo. Note that after the flood(Dependent on which timeline you go by), Skullkids no longer have beaks.
Skull kids are pretty much helpless as the land is about to flood.

However, they all have the 'Zora symbol' but i'm stuck on thinking that that symbol isn't Zora so much as Nayru. Who happened to play a harp as an incarnated Oracle.

Also, If you'll look at Stalchildren and Ritos, they both have red eyes. Zora eyes are fishy black.

[Smitie]

Here's my offset opinion:
The Zora didn't evolve. Why would they evolve? If their water mass just got BIGGER why try and live above water?
No, I considered the Korok's evolution. The Koroks learned how to fly using the leaves provided by the Great Deku Tree Jr.
The Gorons are either IN the mountains, or mostly wiped out, but they still exist so It's not Gorons.
Hylians obviously are still around on islands.
The Gerudos...are still pirates i'm sure. I believe that they lived in the fortress and then Ganondorf turned them all into pigs.
So what major race does this leave?
What race is the only one with beaks, and still canon?
What's the race that everyone forgets, figuratively and literally?
Skull kids.
Skull kids have beaks. And if they're all lost in the forest, how can they figure out how to do things like Koroks? Through the spirit of Valoo. Note that after the flood(Dependent on which timeline you go by), Skullkids no longer have beaks.
Skull kids are pretty much helpless as the land is about to flood.

However, they all have the 'Zora symbol' but i'm stuck on thinking that that symbol isn't Zora so much as Nayru. Who happened to play a harp as an incarnated Oracle.

Also, If you'll look at Stalchildren and Ritos, they both have red eyes. Zora eyes are fishy black.

In evolution terms it would be logical if the zora eyes changed. They have eyes that are designed to look under water. If they kept these eyes if they got on land/ turn into rito they would see all blurry. I think the zora's got a little help from the gods, because a animal species can't evolve so drasticly in just a couple hundred years.

[blackice_cc]

Well, the Rito evolving from Skull kids sounds sort of logical, except for the fact that it doesn't account for the missing Zora's. It's more likely that the Zora's evolved into the Rito with a little help from the Gods, so that they wouldn't find the old Hyrule. Zora's would probably settle on the bottom of the sea, and the Gods wouldn't want them to discover old Hyrule, they wanted the people above the sea to make a new one.

[Leix]

Why wouldn't the Goddesses want them to find Hyrule? Ganon was the only one who dosen't want people heading to Hyrule. Wait, who flooded Hyrule? Was it Ganon, or was it the Goddesses stopping Ganon?

Ok, and about the eyes Smitie. If they couldn't see on land, then why the heck are Zoras standing on land all the time?

And another question: Where do the LoZ Zoras fit into this? They look much different, and prefer to kill people on land from water instead of communicate.

[blackice_cc]

And another question: Where do the LoZ Zoras fit into this? They look much different, and prefer to kill people on land from water instead of communicate.

The Zora's in LoZ are river Zora's (http://zeldawiki.org/River_Zora), who are pretty hostile. Also, it was the Goddesses who flooded Hyrule to stop Ganon, and as for not wanting anyone to find Hyrule, in WW it said that the Godesses wanted the people to find a new Hyrule (I'm pretty sure) instead of finding the old one for some reason.

[Leix]

Yet they gave out pretty pearls and set up three islands?

[blackice_cc]

Yet they gave out pretty pearls and set up three islands?

Well, the Goddesses might have thought that Ganon would one day come back, so they set up a way to the Master Sword that only a Hero could get to. Also, we should probably get back on topic, but I can't think of anything more to say about the Rito.

[Onilink89]

whoooh what did i miss here, now its suddenly skull kids and stalchildren.
people come up with theories these days depending 2 much on the looks. and we even brought the zora 's from the other zelda titles here.

there are 3 major points that support this theory:
1. the symbol
2. the sage
3. the sage saying only the bloodline carries the instrument

Leix, i agree with one thing with you. why the hell did the zora 's evovle when there is so many water that they could live, they didn 't need a reason to adjust. thats also what i was thinking in the first place
but...
as i said in one of my earlier posts, we are missing one important fact. the king of red lions told you something about that all people took refuge in the mountain tops when ganon escaped from the sacred realm. and then the gods decided to seal hyrule so the great flood occurd. so it would make sense why the zora evolved. and why the gorons didn 't in WW. the gorons already lived in the mountains, the zora would have by now adjusted theirselfs before the great flood. but most of the gorons is wiped out.

[Leix]

Well, I believe that
1. The symbol is simply a symbol representative of Nayru, not nescisarilly Zoras. It was on the pearl. And if you'll notice, only Jabun himself had Nayru's pearl, the Rito tribe only had the silly Din's pearl.
2 & 3. I know I know, but whos to say that t here wasn't any cross breeding or anything along those lines?l
And your fourth point dosen't seem to really answer anything about the Zora evolving. It still dosen't make any sense for Zora to take refugee.

[Onilink89]

Well, I believe that
1. The symbol is simply a symbol representative of Nayru, not nescisarilly Zoras. It was on the pearl. And if you'll notice, only Jabun himself had Nayru's pearl, the Rito tribe only had the silly Din's pearl.
2 & 3. I know I know, but whos to say that t here wasn't any cross breeding or anything along those lines?l
And your fourth point dosen't seem to really answer anything about the Zora evolving. It still dosen't make any sense for Zora to take refugee.

ok i will try my best to awnser this:
1. if you say that symbol represent naryu, then explain why the spitual stones are also shaped in those symbol. if they also representthe 3 goddesses, it still would not make any sense, because din 's pearl as a whole other symbol. what would that say? is there a 4th goddess or something, i higly doubt that.
2&3
- i don 't know anything about cross breeding, but who can breed with zora 's?
- my 4th point doesn 't makes sense? why? zora+living in high mountain doesn 't fit in my eyes. and for the 3th time, they took refuge because ganon escaped from the sacred realm.
so to put it simple: ganon escaped from sacred realm ---> people hope for the hero of time to return--->hero doesn 't shop up--->people take refuge to the mountains.

[Leix]

ok i will try my best to awnser this:
1. if you say that symbol represent naryu, then explain why the spitual stones are also shaped in those symbol. if they also representthe 3 goddesses, it still would not make any sense, because din 's pearl as a whole other symbol. what would that say? is there a 4th goddess or something, i higly doubt that. ...
- my 4th point doesn 't makes sense? why? zora+living in high mountain doesn 't fit in my eyes. and for the 3th time, they took refuge because ganon escaped from the sacred realm.
so to put it simple: ganon escaped from sacred realm ---> people hope for the hero of time to return--->hero doesn 't shop up--->people take refuge to the mountains.
But the Zoras don't LIVE in the mountains, they primarily live UNDER THE WATER! And why would they need to take refugee!? Isn't being in the water well hidden enough!? The humans flee to the mountains because they can not live under the water, but the Zoras? Why wouldn't they just swim down to the bottom stay there?

[MrMosley]

I think that the Rito tribe are supposed to be descendants of the Zora, but no it does not make sense. Ganon escaping the Sacred Realm is irrelevant to the fact that the water is unsafe in the Great Sea because Ganon does not want to take over the Great Sea. He simply wants the Triforce. When Ganon escapes and Hyrule is submerged, the people take refuge on the mountains because they cannot live underwater, who knows what happend to the Gorons, and Ganon goes above water to search for Zelda...Which is where we have Wind Waker taking place eventually.

The Seas are not in any danger because of Ganon or his minions; therefore, there is no reason a Zora would be unable to continue living as they are.

[Onilink89]

But the Zoras don't LIVE in the mountains, they primarily live UNDER THE WATER! And why would they need to take refugee!? Isn't being in the water well hidden enough!? The humans flee to the mountains because they can not live under the water, but the Zoras? Why wouldn't they just swim down to the bottom stay there?

you tell me, or go ask the king of red lions.
he is the one who said about the whole refuge thing.
but from what i read from your post, you think the people took refuge because of the great flood. they already fled to the mountains before the great flood accurd. the reason is that ganon took over hyrule and the hero didn 't show up. and then the gods decided to drown hyrule.

[Nemesis]

When we see the Kokorok plays on his instrument, a Kokiri is "standing" behind him, and we at Zelda Dungeon know that the kokoroks were Kokiris before.

And when we see the Rito plays on her instrument, a Zora is "standing" behind her.

[Zenox]

According to what I've learned, there was a glitch in Majora's Mask enabling the Zora Link (Miaku) to 'Fly' in the Great Bay. Nintendo learned this and used that glitch as an idea for the Wind Waker.

[Wings]

Sorry about that, I assumed that PH was in the same setting as TWW was. I don't own the game, nor do I remember the ending in TWW. Now that I understand that, it even further strengthens my beliefs that the Rito are the evolved creatures that came from the Zora.

I just remembered something crucial to this theory. As you all know, Makar is a Korok from Forest Haven who plays the violin. Fado is a Kokiri, and also the previous Sage of Wind, who played the same violin as Makar does. Is there a possible connection here?

Medli is a Rito from Dragon Roost Island who plays the harp. Laruto is a Zora, the former Sage of Earth, and plays the same harp that Medli is seen playing too. Not to mention she is wearing the same sash type cloth that Medli is wearing. Is this yet another connection between races?

Its been pretty well established that the kokiri became Koroks, Kokiri houses are in the Forbidden Woods and the Deku Tree says as much himself.
Biology as a reason would make sense. The Zora's were clearly designed for shallow waters. In all instances, the Zora's are close to land (OoT, MM, TP), thus preferring it thus designed for it. Therefore, when the ocean flooded, the Zoras had to fly or die as it were. Add in a little divine intervention (Valoo), the Ritos could get their wings and begin happy jobs as postal workers. Finally, the Zora's from PH are there because there are two divergent Zora races, one of River Zoras and one of Ocean Zoras. River Zoras are the fish that would spit fire balls at you in LA and OoS/OoA. It would make sense that these fish became PH Zoras, and the more civilized Zoras became the Rito

[Master Kokiri 9]

most of us know the Rito Tribe in WW. the main subject about this tribe that i always questioned is: did the zora race really evolve in to the rito tribe, is so how come?

now there are clues that prove this, like medli, got the zora logo on her clothes and she carries the bloodline of the zora sage. but would it not be better if they remained zora's? i mean you got the great sea and all of a sudden they have wings thanx to lord valoo.
or is lord valoo the cause that the zora 's became rito's?

You are right it would probably be better if they remained zoras but if they evolved into the rito then how could there be zoras in phantom hourglass not even a year after windwaker as well as there still being rito postmen. my guess is that 'semiaquatic' zoras that spend most of their lives near water with some swimming for fishy zora stuff they figured that it would be easier to adapt wings to get around after the great flood and also to survive it cuz they couldn't survive in water that deep. and in the case of the ocean king ocean the river zoras which i refer to as zolas evolved ever so slightly into zola warriors and between st and ph they migrated to new hyrule where they evolved again into fire zola warriors and mighty zola warriors. So there is my explanation.

[Zemen]

You are right it would probably be better if they remained zoras but if they evolved into the rito then how could there be zoras in phantom hourglass not even a year after windwaker as well as there still being rito postmen. my guess is that 'semiaquatic' zoras that spend most of their lives near water with some swimming for fishy zora stuff they figured that it would be easier to adapt wings to get around after the great flood and also to survive it cuz they couldn't survive in water that deep. and in the case of the ocean king ocean the river zoras which i refer to as zolas evolved ever so slightly into zola warriors and between st and ph they migrated to new hyrule where they evolved again into fire zola warriors and mighty zola warriors. So there is my explanation.

A couple of things to address here.

1. The Zora sage says that you have to find her descendant. Her descendant ended up being a member of the Rito tribe. Shouldn't need too much more proof there.

But if you do need more proof, here is number...

2. There are no Zora in Phantom Hourglass. If I am wrong could you please point out which part of the game has Zora? I know that there are monsters called Zora Warriors, but it is very safe to assume that they are not the same species as the Zora that appear in other games. In fact, they are probably more related to the Zola which are also seen as a different species than the Zora.

And this last point is just to correct something you said.

3. The Rito aren't born with wings. They have to go to Valoo(?) and retrieve one of his scales and then that is how they get their wings. This means that the Zora couldn't just decide to grow wings. In fact, based on any form of evolution, no one decides how they evolve. They just end up evolving best with their environment. So if they did evolve it was to best suit what they needed. I believe one of the games says Zora don't like salt water. The best way to get away from salt water is to fly. If they evolved because of the scales of Valoo, that is still something that was most likely against their wishes.

[Clucluclu]

Revelation: Godessess turned Zora into Ruto.

Why, you ask? Because they wanted to keep Hyrule hidden forever. They sent all the species to the mountains (excluding Gerudo) but the Zora were probably partying like "Woohoo! Hyrules gonna be an ocean! F*** Yeah!" and so the Godesses sent lord Valoo to have them turned into Ruto so that they wouldn't be able to find Hyrule.

This would also explain why there are Zora/Zola in PH because the oceans there are those of the Ocean King and have no relation to Hyrule other than the possibility that it is somehow an alternate demension like Termina, or perhaps something more like Koholint in LA.

[Zarom]

The Kokiri have evolved into the Koroks, because it is what the Deku Tree says and Makar is a descendant of Fado, a Kokiri. :)

I think that the Zoras have evolved into Ritos because Medli is a descendant of Laruto, who is a Zora. :zora:

The Gorons have stayed Gorons, since the islands are in fact the top of the mountains and that is their natural ''habitat''. However, they nearly become extinct (only three left). Does that mean that many Gorons died of the Great Flood? :goron:

And the Gerudos aren't the ones who haven't gone on top of the mountains, Dekus too. But since it happened in Hyrule and the Dekus in the forest/lost woods were more monsters than a tribe in that game. :deku:

That's all.

[Clucluclu]

I think that the Goron's were down to 3 because the islands that they were on eventually ran out of resources (rocks) and they died out as they couldn't move to other islands.

[Aurora]

This is what I think, When the great flood came, soot from Death Mountain infected the water near the zoras and they had to climb on the land and live there!
OR.. Or maybe
Ganondorf got pissed at the zoras for keeping something from him, pearls, crystals, ect., and layed a curse on them!

[Zeruda]

http://knightsofhyrule.org/rito.png

青沼 「時のオカリナ」に登場したゾーラ族の進化した形がリト族で、コキリ族が森から離れてコログ族になった、と いう設定です。見た目はまるで違いますが、血は継承されています。
AONUMA: We created the Rito as the evolved form of the Zora that appeared in "Ocarina of Time" and the Koroks as what the Kokiri became once they left the forest. They appear different, but they have inherited their blood.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Laruto: "O great hero, chosen by the Master Sword! My name is Laruto. I am a Zora sage. For an age, I offered my prayers here in the Earth Temple, praying that the power to repel evil would ever remain within the Master Sword. And yet... unfortunately, due to Ganondorf's evil designs, the Master Sword you hold has lost this power. After his defeat at the hands of the Hero of Time, Ganondorf was sealed away... but not for all time. He was revived, and he returned to Hyrule in a red wrath. He attacked this temple and stole my soul, knowing that he had to remove the power contained in that enchanted blade. In order to return the power to repel evil to your sword, you must find another to take my stead in this temple and ask the gods for their assistance. You must find the one who carries on my bloodline... The one who holds this sacred instrument... Nothing can stop the flow of time or the passing of generations... but the fate carried within my bloodline endures the ravages of all the years. It survives. The song you just conducted is one which will open the eyes of the new sage and awaken within that sage the melody that will carry our prayers to the gods. The door that blocks your way will only open when the sage plays that song. May the winds of fortune blow with you."
:::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Medli: "Just now, a sage spoke to me. She spoke so gently... There is something... something I must do. Link... Thanks to you, I've been awakened to the knowledge that I'm a sage of the Earth Temple. There's actually something that I can do to help this world. It's incredible... I bet my teacher knew all about this... Link, please... You must take me to the Earth Temple. We must hurry and wake the power to repel evil that sleeps within the Master Sword."
(SOURCE (http://faqs.ign.com/articles/432/432012p1.html))
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...gosh I'm a nerd. Also, fun fact, the Rito tribe was inspired by Akira Himekawa's original Watarara race. As for evolution, it's not so hard to see how those big fins on their arms eventually were able to become wings.

[Master Kokiri 9]

A couple of things to address here.

1. The Zora sage says that you have to find her descendant. Her descendant ended up being a member of the Rito tribe. Shouldn't need too much more proof there.

But if you do need more proof, here is number...

2. There are no Zora in Phantom Hourglass. If I am wrong could you please point out which part of the game has Zora? I know that there are monsters called Zora Warriors, but it is very safe to assume that they are not the same species as the Zora that appear in other games. In fact, they are probably more related to the Zola which are also seen as a different species than the Zora.

And this last point is just to correct something you said.

3. The Rito aren't born with wings. They have to go to Valoo(?) and retrieve one of his scales and then that is how they get their wings. This means that the Zora couldn't just decide to grow wings. In fact, based on any form of evolution, no one decides how they evolve. They just end up evolving best with their environment. So if they did evolve it was to best suit what they needed. I believe one of the games says Zora don't like salt water. The best way to get away from salt water is to fly. If they evolved because of the scales of Valoo, that is still something that was most likely against their wishes.

Dude while there were no civil zoras that were peaceful there were the malicous ones which attack you as the fishy warriors at places like the cave on molidia and at the spot on molidia where you have to defeat two of them to reveal a statue.

[Zemen]

Dude while there were no civil zoras that were peaceful there were the malicous ones which attack you as the fishy warriors at places like the cave on molidia and at the spot on molidia where you have to defeat two of them to reveal a statue.

Did you even read my post, because I specifically mentioned those specific Zora that you are talking about.

This is the part I addressed it at...you even quoted it...


2. There are no Zora in Phantom Hourglass. If I am wrong could you please point out which part of the game has Zora? I know that there are monsters called Zora Warriors, but it is very safe to assume that they are not the same species as the Zora that appear in other games. In fact, they are probably more related to the Zola which are also seen as a different species than the Zora.

They are called Warrior Zora (or Zora Warriors) and they are of a different specie of Zora.

Try reading through posts before responding because it's annoying when people quote someones post and make a statement that was addressed in that persons post.

[Master Kokiri 9]

A couple of things to address here.

1. The Zora sage says that you have to find her descendant. Her descendant ended up being a member of the Rito tribe. Shouldn't need too much more proof there.

But if you do need more proof, here is number...

2. There are no Zora in Phantom Hourglass. If I am wrong could you please point out which part of the game has Zora? I know that there are monsters called Zora Warriors, but it is very safe to assume that they are not the same species as the Zora that appear in other games. In fact, they are probably more related to the Zola which are also seen as a different species than the Zora.

And this last point is just to correct something you said.

3. The Rito aren't born with wings. They have to go to Valoo(?) and retrieve one of his scales and then that is how they get their wings. This means that the Zora couldn't just decide to grow wings. In fact, based on any form of evolution, no one decides how they evolve. They just end up evolving best with their environment. So if they did evolve it was to best suit what they needed. I believe one of the games says Zora don't like salt water. The best way to get away from salt water is to fly. If they evolved because of the scales of Valoo, that is still something that was most likely against their wishes.

Dude zolas are in my view a simple political classification that means uncivilized zoras. And I know that rito aren't born with wings. When i said they thought it would best that they adapt wings i sorta goofed. What i meant was to say that they develope the ability to sustain themselves at rather high altitudes. And at the top of the mountain which during ww is dragon roost was valoo who decided to grant them wings. Also they could've just used magic or maybe help from the goddesses to evolve. And also that might be true but if they hate salt water then why would they live in the great bay in mm. And bays are technically bodies of saltwater which are surrounded on three sides by land.


Did you even read my post, because I specifically mentioned those specific Zora that you are talking about.

This is the part I addressed it at...you even quoted it...



They are called Warrior Zora (or Zora Warriors) and they are of a different specie of Zora.

Try reading through posts before responding because it's annoying when people quote someones post and make a statement that was addressed in that persons post.

Dude zola warriors are technically a subspecies of zora which technically means a slight variation of the species of which it is a sub (yes i was quoting fawful there). Sorry that i was unclear.

[Locke]

(If you don't think the Zora became the Rito, save that for a different topic, please.)

I just wanted to see some discussion on how exactly the Zora ended up looking like birds. The only two possibilities that I know of are that they (d)evolved or that they were transformed by the goddesses when Hyrule was flooded.

What we know:
"...before the sealing of the kingdom,
the gods chose those who would build a
new country and commanded them to take
refuge on the mountaintops." -King Daphnes

"...When a Rito reaches adulthood, he
or she journeys to the top of Dragon Roost
to receive a scale from the great dragon.
It is this scale that enables the Rito to
grow his or her wings." -Rito Chieftain


So they didn't escape to the mountaintops just to escape extinction. The goddesses commanded them to.
And they didn't turn directly from amphibious creatures to flying creatures. They were more human-like before Valoo came.
Just keep these in mind when providing your thoughts. (they can be used as evidence either way.)


I think the goddesses transformed them into land creatures because they didn't want the Zora to adapt to the new water and become the dominant species or disturb Hyrule.


Another interesting quote:
"They are vast seas...
None can swim across them...
They yield no fish to catch..." -Ganondorf, on Zelda's dreams

I think the lack of fish in this quote is a metaphor for her insecurities and her inability to find total satisfaction in life, but it could also be taken literally meaning the Great Sea has no fish, and therefore no food for the Zoras.

[Locke]

Also, why did they move to Death Mountain? Jabun, their original guardian diety, resides in Greatfish Isle. Comparing the maps of OoT and WW, it appears that Greatfish Isle is above the Gerudo Valley.
The most sense I can make of that is if the entire Zora race, along with Jabu-Jabu, migrated through the passage to Lake Hylia, then upstream a bit, where Din created Greatfish Isle and Farore transformed them into land creatures. But then I have no idea why some of them moved to Dragon Roost.
Or perhaps only some migrated through Lake Hylia and the rest climbed Death Mountain (which neighbors Zora's Domain). That would mean the inhabitants of Greatfish Isle were the human forms of the Zora, and those of Dragon Roost were the ones to whom Valoo gave wings.
But then that raises the question of Valoo... Is he Volvagia? Why is he good now? Why is he supporting the Rito and not the Gorons? Why did the Gorons leave?

[Mikenike]

Also, why did they move to Death Mountain? Jabun, their original guardian diety, resides in Greatfish Isle. Comparing the maps of OoT and WW, it appears that Greatfish Isle is above the Gerudo Valley.
The most sense I can make of that is if the entire Zora race, along with Jabu-Jabu, migrated through the passage to Lake Hylia, then upstream a bit, where Din created Greatfish Isle and Farore transformed them into land creatures. But then I have no idea why some of them moved to Dragon Roost.
Or perhaps only some migrated through Lake Hylia and the rest climbed Death Mountain (which neighbors Zora's Domain). That would mean the inhabitants of Greatfish Isle were the human forms of the Zora, and those of Dragon Roost were the ones to whom Valoo gave wings.
But then that raises the question of Valoo... Is he Volvagia? Why is he good now? Why is he supporting the Rito and not the Gorons? Why did the Gorons leave?

When did the zora's move to death mountain? Last time I recall i see them in the domain every game. There may be one or two who travel across the map but they are always in water or near it.

[Locke]

When did the zora's move to death mountain? Last time I recall i see them in the domain every game. There may be one or two who travel across the map but they are always in water or near it.
The Rito in WW. I don't know if they moved before or after they transformed into land-dwellers, but they did eventually end up on top of Death Mountain (Dragon Roost Island). Though I think some of them remained on Greatfish Island.

[Evil Space Fish]

Centuries after OoT (the space inbetween TWW) was biblical in a sense. The Great Flood takes place, obviously wiping out pretty much everyone besides the Zora. Goron's are scarce in WW and virtually gone in the later (older) games.

I speculate that when the other races of Hyrule realized that there would be no more land, the strongest survived and took refuge in the mountain tops. The Zoras, being water dwellers, had to reverse adapt. No fish in the sea... they started dying out. Natural selection/evolution must take place. I can't explain exactly how a fish turns into a bird... but you can imagine that it took a long time. Long enough for the other races of flooded Hyrule to build the temples, colonate the mountain tops, and pass these down thru legend. the Zora are the only race that had the most trouble adapting (besides the dying race of Gorons because they don't swim) due to their diet, living style, and destruction of their diety in OoT. Just a thought.

[Locke]

I speculate that when the other races of Hyrule realized that there would be no more land, the strongest survived and took refuge in the mountain tops.
But the goddesses chose those who would survive, so it's not survival of the fittest, but survival of the chosen. And they didn't just 'realize' they had to go to the mountaintops, they were "commanded."


The Zoras, being water dwellers, had to reverse adapt. No fish in the sea... they started dying out. Natural selection/evolution must take place.
This seems to be what most people think, but I take the 'no fish in the sea' quote metaphorically, meaning they wouldn't have to adapt, Farore made them. Though there is no proof either way.


I can't explain exactly how a fish turns into a bird... but you can imagine that it took a long time. Long enough for the other races of flooded Hyrule to build the temples, colonate the mountain tops, and pass these down thru legend.
They would only have to turn into humans, Valoo did the rest. Even so, it would take millions of years for them to accomplish that, while WW is said to take place 'hundreds of years' after OoT.[/QUOTE]


...and destruction of their diety in OoT.
? You're saying Jabun isn't Jabu-Jabu?

[Evil Space Fish]

You're saying Jabun isn't Jabu-Jabu?

Well a decendant at least. I know he makes an appearance as a dungeon in the OoA game which I oversaught in my first post.

As far as the "chosen" maybe the Zora got a little pissed that their race had to adapt and may be a reason they are an enemy as Zola's/Zora's in later games? It's possible I guess. I've alway thought the 100 year span is a little short but you make some good points there, Locke.

[Locke]

I've come up with two more problems with my theory:

1) The amount of time that passes between OoT and Ganon's escape is unspecified.
"The boy's tale was passed down through
generations until it became legend..."
This could be hundreds of years, thousands, millions...
The only "hundreds of years" quote we have is referring to the period between Ganon's escape and WW.
Though Aonuma said it took place 100 years after OoT, that seems to contradict the game anyway. Perhaps he meant Ganon escapes 100 years after OoT? ...but then that wouldn't give enough time for the HoT to become legend.
This could support the theory of evolution.

2)Wind and Earth sages
As I said in the "how many sages are there" thread, I think the position of Water Sage was changed to Earth Sage by the goddesses at the time of the flood because they didn't want anyone to have any control over the water, and the Forest Sage became the Wind Sage because forests are scarce post-flood and winds are in abundance.
However, I seemed to have overlooked the fact that the Wind and Earth temples had been constructed long before the flood (their entrances are underwater), and the positions would have changed before Ganondorf killed the sages (Laruto and Fado are sages of Earth and Wind).
This would mean that the positions would have to have been changed before Ganon escaped, but I don't see any reason for this change to occur at that time. I don't really want to believe that these are two entirely new sages.

Could someone please help ease my mind?

[Onilink89]

~threads merged~ ( Rito Tribe+ How Did the Zora Become the Rito? )

before you make a thread, please check if that topic already created by an other member.