New Ganondorf?

[Chris]

Well I was looking over the Timeline section and I noticed something, TP takes place about 100 years after Oot. So, if we remember the special rule, "A male Gerudo is born every 100 years," Then what happened to the second ganondorf? Think, it was 100 years after Oot, which was not the first game, so that adds even more to the years. So, if way over 100 years have past, where is this new Ganondorf.

Discuss.

[Zemen]

Well I was looking over the Timeline section and I noticed something, TP takes place about 100 years after Oot. So, if we remember the special rule, "A male Gerudo is born every 100 years," Then what happened to the second ganondorf? Think, it was 100 years after Oot, which was not the first game, so that adds even more to the years. So, if way over 100 years have past, where is this new Ganondorf.

Discuss.

the Gerudo are not in any other games except for OoT and MM which take place close together. there cant be a male born every 100 years if there is no Gerudo race to make this so.

they died out somewhere along the way, leaving ganondorf the last male of the race, and ganondorf is immortal, so to speak, so no, there is no new ganondorf.

and ganondorf was power hungry, and evil. even if the Gerudo were still around and there was a male, that doesnt mean he would be evil, because if you remember, the Gerudo are not evil at all, just ganondorf. so if there is a new male, it is likely he is just living his life with his people.

[Chris]

Well, I know the race was wiped out but since the race of gerudos were all female, how can they reproduce? It leaves me to thinking that Males are "formed" every 100 years, but without any help from the Gerudos.

What leads me to thinking that he would be evil is that there is only one Gerudo male that we know of and he is evil, so how do we know that all of the Gerudo males aren't evil?

Also, you said that the Gerudo were only in Oot and MM, right? Well Ganondorf was in Loz and Aol too, so you are wrong.

[Kazumi]

Welllllllll chances are thats the same Ganondorf from OoT because the Triforce of Power makes him immortal. Also in my opinion (this may be weird.....) wouldn't the male (Ganondorf for example) 'mate' with random Gerudo and that would make new Gerudo and one would be a boy and then it would repeat. But since Ganondorf was in the Evil Realm they would die out because they could not reproduce. Right???>.>

[Kitsu]

Well, I know the race was wiped out but since the race of gerudos were all female, how can they reproduce? It leaves me to thinking that Males are "formed" every 100 years, but without any help from the Gerudos.

What leads me to thinking that he would be evil is that there is only one Gerudo male that we know of and he is evil, so how do we know that all of the Gerudo males aren't evil?

Also, you said that the Gerudo were only in Oot and MM, right? Well Ganondorf was in Loz and Aol too, so you are wrong.

According to Ocarina of Time, the Gerudo leave for castle town to "find a boyfriend".

And true, that idea of Ganondorf being evil due to the fact he is Gerudo isn't very objective, if at all. However, I would imagine that he was born with a certain geneolgy that induced his lust for power, complemented by any grudges he might hold agaist the Royal Family.
In Twilight Princess, Zant talks about how much he despises the Royal Family and how they disgust him. I would imagine Ganondorf would feel likewise.


Ganondorf was in LoZ and AoL, however, Ganon was portrayed as a 'pig' like creature in AoL, and has seen other incarnations than humanoid. This leads me to believe one thing,



and ganondorf is immortal, so to speak

I don't think Ganondorf would be immortal, but more, 'Ganon', is immortal. Ganon consistently appears, but only appears in a humanoid form in a few games. Also, when you fight 'Ganon', in Ocarina of Time, he appears more like a 'pig', as his 'true' form. However, that's just my speculation on the matter.

[Kybyrian]

Well, for one, if there was another male Gerudo, they wouldn't necessarily call him Ganondorf, anyway.

And, as stated in I think the second post, the Gerudo died out somewhere along the way, leaving Ganondorf, whom is immortal, so to say.

And along the terms of the Gerudo's reproducing, I'm going to assume that HylianPrincess is correct.

[Chris]

Welllllllll chances are thats the same Ganondorf from OoT because the Triforce of Power makes him immortal. Also in my opinion (this may be weird.....) wouldn't the male (Ganondorf for example) 'mate' with random Gerudo and that would make new Gerudo and one would be a boy and then it would repeat. But since Ganondorf was in the Evil Realm they would die out because they could not reproduce. Right???>.>

Well, your theroy seems right but, if Ganondorf was to mate with random Gerudos, what happened if they never had a Male and it was only female. Also, how was the first male created anyways, if there was no male to start with, then they could not reproduce. Since a male is created every 100 years, there could not have been a starting Male, they would have to wait 100 years for it, though how is that male formed if there is only females, he must have been created by someone. And every 100 years, that same person probably makes a new Male.

[Kybyrian]

Asking how the first male came to be is like asking how everything else came to be.

1. It's a game, much less a Zelda Game.

2. I'm assuming the Goddesses had their part in it, of course.

[Kazumi]

Welllllllllll just like in real life (even though i support evelution) the goddesess created the Gerudo already having a male just like Hylians. And according to the legend every 100 years so there would have to be a male for the legend to be true. So there isnt a time with no male except when Ganon nob was in the Evil Realm so they died out.

[Chris]

Asking how the first male came to be is like asking how everything else came to be.

1. It's a game, much less a Zelda Game.

2. I'm assuming the Goddesses had their part in it, of course.

Well, the goddesses probably made the first Male but think of this, Why is there a male every 100 years, if he keeps randomly mating, like you said was correct, then how do you know it will be every 100 years? If it is "random" Mating, then how do you know a male will not be born within the 100 years.

[octorok74]

Koume and Kotake were the surragate mother of Ganondorf in OOT, so if they didn't actually die then they could have done the same thing all over again.

[Kazumi]

Well if there was no male then they would have died out along time ago. So there always has been.

[Kitsu]

This would probably lead to a fallacious argument, but oh well.

I would suppose that the chromosomes of the Gerudo have a dominant trait causing there to be more chances of a male child. Also, who says that only one child is born every 100 years? I'm sure there could be other children born, but only a male child is kept. However, that still doesn't explain why it's exaclty 100 years. I guess because it's Zelda.

[Kybyrian]

Well, the goddesses probably made the first Male but think of this, Why is there a male every 100 years, if he keeps randomly mating, like you said was correct, then how do you know it will be every 100 years? If it is "random" Mating, then how do you know a male will not be born within the 100 years.

You prove a point and bring me to the part where I change my original statement. It's possible that every one-hundred years, the Goddesses create another male Gerudo. I mean, it seems plausible, but I guess we won't ever know for sure.

[Zemen]

you guys should actually do research before making accusations, or ask questions rahter than saying what you think is true. if you pay attention to OoT, the gossip stones tell you that the Gerudo go to Hyrule to find Hylian Boyfriends (not exact quote). this means that they mate with those men, not Gerudo men (because there is only one every 100 years. the Gerudo mate with the Hylian race, creating more Gerudo females, then, after 100 years, a male is born. technically speaking, Ganondorf is part Hylian.

also, when i said that ganondorf is immortal, i meant his spirit, not his body.

and one more thing. ganondorf was not in AoL or LoZ, Ganon was. ganon is not even human, let alone a Gerudo.

[Chris]

You prove a point and bring me to the part where I change my original statement. It's possible that every one-hundred years, the Goddesses create another male Gerudo. I mean, it seems plausible, but I guess we won't ever know for sure.

Well this does kind of prove that a video game is a video game and can break the laws of physics. But that is why we have the Zelda Mysteries section right?

[Kitsu]

you guys should actually do research before making accusations, or ask questions rahter than saying what you think is true. if you pay attention to OoT, the gossip stones tell you that the Gerudo go to Hyrule to find Hylian Boyfriends (not exact quote). this means that they mate with those men, not Gerudo men (because there is only one every 100 years. the Gerudo mate with the Hylian race, creating more Gerudo females, then, after 100 years, a male is born. technically speaking, Ganondorf is part Hylian.

also, when i said that ganondorf is immortal, i meant his spirit, not his body.

and one more thing. ganondorf was not in AoL or LoZ, Ganon was. ganon is not even human, let alone a Gerudo.

Indeed. I said something about the "Hyrulian boyfriends" in a previous post.
Also, my point was also exactly what you said about 'Ganon' being in LoZ and AoL. I also believe Ganon's spirit was in those games.

[Chris]

you guys should actually do research before making accusations, or ask questions rahter than saying what you think is true. if you pay attention to OoT, the gossip stones tell you that the Gerudo go to Hyrule to find Hylian Boyfriends (not exact quote). this means that they mate with those men, not Gerudo men (because there is only one every 100 years. the Gerudo mate with the Hylian race, creating more Gerudo females, then, after 100 years, a male is born. technically speaking, Ganondorf is part Hylian.

also, when i said that ganondorf is immortal, i meant his spirit, not his body.

and one more thing. ganondorf was not in AoL or LoZ, Ganon was. ganon is not even human, let alone a Gerudo.

Now, I will only say this once: GANON AND GANONDORF ARE THE SAME PERSON! As you see in Oot, Ganondorf "transforms" into Ganon. He can also change back (We learn this in TP where he changes from a beast to his Gerudo form. So you are VERY wrong.

[Kazumi]

Well then if Gerudo's mate with Hylains why are all the Gerudo the same and show no Hylian Resemblence. But that Gossip Stone is valid......hmmmmmmm

[Kybyrian]

and one more thing. ganondorf was not in AoL or LoZ, Ganon was. ganon is not even human, let alone a Gerudo.


But in the rest of your quote, that actually makes me change my original statement yet again, and yours seems even more accurate than the others I've seen, bonus for the Gossip Stone.

[Kitsu]

Now, I will only say this once: GANON AND GANONDORF ARE THE SAME PERSON! As you see in Oot, Ganondorf "transforms" into Ganon. He can also change back (We learn this in TP where he changes from a beast to his Gerudo form. So you are VERY wrong.

Ganon's spirit may be inside Ganondorf, and they are indeed the same person, but the whole point of bringing up 'Ganon' and his 'spirit', was to support the arument of "Ganon being immortal".
I say this because I believe Ganon as a 'spirit', 'demon' 'demigod', or whatever you want to call him, could have multiple incarnatrions, hence 'Ganondorf.'

[octorok74]

Could that also play in to effect as to how Phantom Ganondorf came around.

[Chris]

Could that also play in to effect as to how Phantom Ganondorf came around.

Well this is alittle of topic but I will answer it anyways. Phantom Ganon is believed to be Ganondorf's pawn, kinda like Zant.

[Kybyrian]

Could that also play in to effect as to how Phantom Ganondorf came around.

Phantom Ganondorf, I'm pretty sure, was just created(with the use of extraordinary magic, of course) by Ganondorf.

[Zemen]

Now, I will only say this once: GANON AND GANONDORF ARE THE SAME PERSON! As you see in Oot, Ganondorf "transforms" into Ganon. He can also change back (We learn this in TP where he changes from a beast to his Gerudo form. So you are VERY wrong.

ganon and ganondorf are the same mind, not the same body. ganon is a pig like demon. ganondorf is a human. youre trying to tell me that ganon is still a Gerudo even though he is not in a human body. if thats the case, then apparently if i switched your brain with that of a rabbit, that would make you human even though youre in a rabbits body.

and, apparently, at one point, he cannot switch back, seeing as how in the games that we believe come later in the timeline, he is only in his demon form.

[Chris]

Phantom Ganondorf, I'm pretty sure, was just created(with the use of extraordinary magic, of course) by Ganondorf.

I believe there is already a Thread that discusses Phantom Ganon and that is what I said there. But that just means you agree with me on how Phantom Ganon was created.

[Kazumi]

Yes very true in the Manga there is a scene with Ganondorf creating Phantom Ganon. And one were Zelda kisses Link on the cheak! *pukes* thoughts of that thread linger still! *pukes*

[Kybyrian]

Zemen is right, at least as far as I think, on the issue concerning Ganondorf and Ganon.

If you pay attention, Ganondorf isn't in Oracle of Ages or Seasons, either, but instead just Ganon.

[Chris]

ganon and ganondorf are the same mind, not the same body. ganon is a pig like demon. ganondorf is a human. youre trying to tell me that ganon is still a Gerudo even though he is not in a human body. if thats the case, then apparently if i switched your brain with that of a rabbit, that would make you human even though youre in a rabbits body.

and, apparently, at one point, he cannot switch back, seeing as how in the games that we believe come later in the timeline, he is only in his demon form.

I will inform you to start that I am in fact a human, and if Ganon has the same mind as Ganondorf, they are the same person, just with diffrent bodies. Now, I am not clear what game you are talking about at the end.

[Zemen]

I will inform you to start that I am in fact a human, and if Ganon has the same mind as Ganondorf, they are the same person, just with diffrent bodies. Now, I am not clear what game you are talking about at the end.

off the top of my head every game except for WW, TP, and OoT are the only games that have ganondorf in them. every other one that has the character in them is Ganon.

you are a human. if your MIND was in a rabbits BODY, you would not be human.

its the same thing as with ganondorf and ganon. same mind (which means the same person). different bodies. thank you.

[Chris]

off the top of my head every game except for WW, TP, and OoT are the only games that have ganondorf in them. every other one that has the character in them is Ganon.

you are a human. if your MIND was in a rabbits BODY, you would not be human.

its the same thing as with ganondorf and ganon. same mind (which means the same person). different bodies. thank you.

Now, they may not be the same person on the outside, but they are on the inside, meaning they think the same. So really, Ganon is Ganondorf with a powered up body.

[Kazumi]

Now I am going to use an example from a book. If you are a boys mind in a redtailed hawk then you are a boy just with the body of a hawk. You still think like a boy but you do hawk stuff.

[Chris]

Now I am going to use an example from a book. If you are a boys mind in a redtailed hawk then you are a boy just with the body of a hawk. You still think like a boy but you do hawk stuff.

That is exactly what I am trying to say. I am not sure if Zemen Agrees.

[Zemen]

Now, they may not be the same person on the outside, but they are on the inside, meaning they think the same. So really, Ganon is Ganondorf with a powered up body.

have you read any of the previous posts? im pretty sure ive already said it is the same mind. would you like me to explain that more? here you go, seeing as how you dont get it.

same mind, same person, same thought process, same likes, same dislikes, same lusts, same evil.

now let me explain the body concept to you. if he is a pig demon, is he human? seems pretty easy to figure out.

we dont call coca cola water just because its main ingredient is water.

dont call ganon, ganondorf because his main ingredient is ganondorf's brain.


Now I am going to use an example from a book. If you are a boys mind in a redtailed hawk then you are a boy just with the body of a hawk. You still think like a boy but you do hawk stuff.

yes, you would be a boy with a hawks body, so you wouldnt be human, youd be a pretty smark hawk.

[Chris]

have you read any of the previous posts? im pretty sure ive already said it is the same mind. would you like me to explain that more? here you go, seeing as how you dont get it.

same mind, same person, same thought process, same likes, same dislikes, same lusts, same evil.

now let me explain the body concept to you. if he is a pig demon, is he human? seems pretty easy to figure out.

we dont call coca cola water just because its main ingredient is water.

dont call ganon, ganondorf because his main ingredient is ganondorf's brain.



yes, you would be a boy with a hawks body, so you wouldnt be human, youd be a pretty smark hawk.

Yes, I understand that you would not be a human, though you would think the same way. I know all that, I just wanted to prove that they think the same way.

[Kazumi]

We should end this thread we already answed 3 questions and now were so off topic this could be 4 threads!

[Chris]

I know, this is a little out of control, I don't want to close this thread but I might have to.

[Zemen]

We should end this thread we already answed 3 questions and now were so off topic this could be 4 threads!

im pretty sure the topic was asking if there is another ganondorf. we are still on topic.

thinking like a human is not the same as being a human, just so you know. the point i was trying to make is that ganon may think and have the mind of ganondorf, but that doesnt make him a gerudo/human.

[Chris]

im pretty sure the topic was asking if there is another ganondorf. we are still on topic.

thinking like a human is not the same as being a human, just so you know. the point i was trying to make is that ganon may think and have the mind of ganondorf, but that doesnt make him a gerudo/human.

O.K, I understand what you are trying to say, I know that when he is a pig/beast he is not a human/gerudo. But he still thinks like one, that is all I am trying to say.

[Zemen]

O.K, I understand what you are trying to say, I know that when he is a pig/beast he is not a human/gerudo. But he still thinks like one, that is all I am trying to say.

ok, but earlier you were trying to tell me that ganon is in AoL and LoZ so that means there are Gerudo in that game. i was just trying to show you that there arent, and you finally got it.

[Master Kokiri 9]

Well I was looking over the Timeline section and I noticed something, TP takes place about 100 years after Oot. So, if we remember the special rule, "A male Gerudo is born every 100 years," Then what happened to the second ganondorf? Think, it was 100 years after Oot, which was not the first game, so that adds even more to the years. So, if way over 100 years have past, where is this new Ganondorf.

Discuss.

The gerudo don't birth a ganny every 100 years but rather their next king. and they probably died out before tp.

[Hayzer]

People always seem to get this wrong. TP and WW take place centuries after OoT. The Japanese word for "century" is the same as "centuries."

So when the developers say 100 years, it's really hundreds of years.

But. No, it wouldn't be a new Ganondorf. It would be a new Gerudo male...but that's it. Nothing else. End of story.

@Kazumi: Your post was back on the first page but let me point out a flaw in your thinking. You can't believe in Evolution and Creation, and you can't merge the two. What would be the point? You'd be hated by both sides. What's the point in that? It would be like saying you believe in Gravity but in your next breath say Gravity doesn't exist...Plus if you're a Creationist, but say you believe [God] used evolution to create life, you'd be undermining God's character. And if you're an EVolutionist who thinks that Intelligent Design isn't that far out there, you'll be kicked out of the evolutionist circle like that. Don't do that. Pick one or the other. People trying to make peace between two sides always get involved in the war, so what's the point.[/rant]

Sorry to stray so far off topic. People who try to merge both theories seem to make me mad.*AHem* I'm better now.

I think Zemen has it spot on.

[Clucluclu]

all the Gerudo were sentenced to death or whatever after OoT.

[Zarom]

I GOT IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It is said that a Gerudo male is born every hundred year. And we may say that the Gerudos are the tribe that was banished in the Twilight Realm. (come on, it's pretty obvious)

A hundred year later, always in the Twilight Realm, the Gerudos (now the Twilis) had a new male Gerudo. That man is Zant!

That would also explain why Zant wants to be the ruler of the Twilis (like Ganondorf with the Gerudos in OOT, altough he actually is their king) and that Midna don't want to accept him as their leader (a bit like Nabooru in OOT who doesn't want Ganondorf to be their King, maybe she is her descendant?) :ganondorf:

What do you think about that?

[Skull_Kid]

I GOT IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It is said that a Gerudo male is born every hundred year. And we may say that the Gerudos are the tribe that was banished in the Twilight Realm. (come on, it's pretty obvious)

A hundred year later, always in the Twilight Realm, the Gerudos (now the Twilis) had a new male Gerudo. That man is Zant!

That would also explain why Zant wants to be the ruler of the Twilis (like Ganondorf with the Gerudos in OOT, altough he actually is their king) and that Midna don't want to accept him as their leader (a bit like Nabooru in OOT who doesn't want Ganondorf to be their King, maybe she is her descendant?) :ganondorf:

What do you think about that?

It's a nice theory for a FANFIC, but there is not even a single IN-GAME proof of that, so, we can't work on it.

About a new Ganondorf....
The simple and only explanation to why Ganondorf is the same in both OoT and TP, is clearly shown in the game, to anyone who knows a bit about Zelda-ology.

At the Execution Scene shown in Arbiters' Grounds, we see Ganondorf getting the Triforce, due to what the Sages call a "divine prank".
Do you need anymore explanations or did you already got it?
Triforce of Power=Immortality.

The only game in the Timeline where it is clearly hinted for a NEW GANONDORF is FSA, but even the game hints that, even though it's a new Ganondorf, Ganon is still the same.

[Master Kokiri 9]

I GOT IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It is said that a Gerudo male is born every hundred year. And we may say that the Gerudos are the tribe that was banished in the Twilight Realm. (come on, it's pretty obvious)

A hundred year later, always in the Twilight Realm, the Gerudos (now the Twilis) had a new male Gerudo. That man is Zant!

That would also explain why Zant wants to be the ruler of the Twilis (like Ganondorf with the Gerudos in OOT, altough he actually is their king) and that Midna don't want to accept him as their leader (a bit like Nabooru in OOT who doesn't want Ganondorf to be their King, maybe she is her descendant?) :ganondorf:

What do you think about that?

ZArom i agree 100% with ya. While you don't have any proof it is a very very plausible theory. Maybe in about 20 years or so nintnendo will finally tell us the truth.